Ramayana

General discussion about the Elder Race, Life, the Universe and Everything.
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Ramayana

Post by Gopi » Sun Dec 03, 2006 3:30 pm

The story is the epic of a King Rama, and goes as follows.

Rama was born in Ayodhya, north India, mostly in 30,000 BC. After getting married to Sita, he was tricked out of his Kingdom by a scheming stepmother, and forced to go into the forest for 14 years. He is accompanied by his brother Lakshmana and wife Sita.

After many adventures in the forest, in the final year, Sita is abducted by Ravana, the king of Lanka [mostly an Atlantean]. Rama meets the Vaanaras during his search for her. These Vaanara are the Vanir of norse mythology, and was a race having a different shape of the jaw and hence known as 'monkey-like'. I am not sure if ALL of them really had tails, though!! The Vaanaras, led by the great generals Hanumaan [the monkey], Jambuvaan [the bear] and the Vaanara King Sugreeva agree to help Rama find Sita. There was deal though, Rama should help Sugreeva get rid of his tyrannical brother Vaali, and in turn he would help him find Sita. That happens, and the Vaanara king sends forth the army on a search...

The group that goes south, with Hanuman, encounter the Riksha cavity and also come out of it. Then, Hanuman swims 800 miles across the sea to reach Lanka. He finds Sita there, trapped in a grove, and consoles her a bit. He then proceeds to create an uproar in Lanka by ravaging the place, and getting caught by Ravana. Ravana, to mock at Hanuman, asks his generals to set fire to the monkey's tail and take him around the city... whereby Hanuman ends up burning the whole of Lanka with that fire... other than Sita's grove.

Ravana asks his father-in-law Maya to reconstruct Lanka, while Hanuman swims back to give Rama the news. Rama now arrives with his whole army, crosses the 'ocean' on a bridge made in 5 days, and vanquishes Ravana's place along with Ravana. He then returns with his wife and brother to Ayodhya, in the Pushpaka Vimana, describing the journey to Sita on the way while pointing out the landmarks.

The span of this great story is approximately 50 years.

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Last edited by Gopi on Thu Feb 08, 2007 5:29 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Ramayana

Post by LoneBear » Mon Dec 11, 2006 3:20 am

There are some other interesting correlations I found in the Ramayana and other sources with other mythos:

Jinn = Genie (English) = Geni (Latin) = Loki (Norse)
[The Jinn were trickster gods; promising wishes that always turned on the wisher... except in the Latin translation, where they are guardian spirits and prophets]

Meru = Midgard (Norse) = Tellus (Latin) = Mount Olympus (Greek)
[The central mountain/continent of the world]

Nagas = Svartálfar (Norse) = Nanus (Latin) = Dero (American) = Draconians (UFO)
[Dwarfs; serpent-like underground dwellers]

Pātāl = Svartálfheim (Norse) = Hell (Christian)
[Abode of Nagas]

Ravana = Diabolus (Latin) = Devil (Christian)
[Head bad guy; transmorph]

Shait̤ān = Satan (Latin,Christian)
[The ultimate adversary; made of fire]

Shukra = Venus (Latin) = Lucifer (English) = Odin (Norse) = Ra (Egyptian) = Kukulcan (Mayan) = Quetzalcoatl (Aztec)
[Clan priest of demons; usually with one eye damaged]

Swarga = Asgard (Norse) = Heaven (English)
[Where you go by choice; home of the Celestials]

Valāhak = Valhalla (Norse)

Vanara = Vanir (Norse) = Circops (Latin)
[Monkey race; native Earthers]

Vayu = Frey (Norse)
[Father of Hanumaan]

Yama = Orcus (Latin) = Hel (Norse) = Angel of Death (English)
[Personification of death; bringer to the underworld--also Orca (F) -- a Whale]

The only association I've found with Pushpak are the flying carpets of Arabia.

I've noticed a lot of commonality of phonetics... looks like mythos tended to either borrow stories from other cultures, or there were one set of "gods", early on in the 3rd density, that got known world-wide.

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Timeline

Post by Gopi » Thu Feb 08, 2007 5:25 am

Here's the timeline of Rama's journey.

NOTE: Please add the value of one precessional cycle to the dates given. That's about 26000 years, btw, does someone have the exact figure for that?

Born: Jan 10, 5114 BC
Off to the forest: Jan 05, 5089 BC [age 25]
His Dad dies: Jan 11, 5089 BC
Sita abducted: Dec 20, 5077 BC [13 years in the forest]
Rama kills Vali: April 3, 5076 BC
Search for Sita: Aug-Sep 5076 BC
Hanuman meets Sita: Sep 12, 5076 BC
Hanuman leaves Lanka: Sep 14, 5076 BC [early morning 6:30]
Rama starts off with army: Sep 20, 5076
Journey to Lanka: 5 days
Kills Ravana: Dec 4, 5076 BC
Back to Ayodhya: Dec 30, 5076 BC.

Source: The Dating of the Era of Lord Ram, by Pushkar Bhatnagar.

The later part of the Ramayana was a precognitive effort by the Author Valmiki, so no one knows for sure what really happened. So we see that the entire epic is based only on a period of 40 years. This leaves a lot more unanswered, about the period, and other civilizations around the world might not have mentioned this extensively. We can only get a connection with the classes of population at the time.
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Great Year ~25,800 years

Post by Eccles » Thu Feb 08, 2007 6:11 am

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_year
A Great year (also known as a Platonic year or Equinoctial cycle) is the time required for one complete cycle of the precession of the equinoxes, about 25800 years, at the current rate. Although astrologers consider it very important, modern day astronomers care little about it. The impact of the precession is raised in discussions of the origins of myths by scholars such as Robert Graves, in his comprehensive work The Greek Myths, who sought those origins from fragments of earlier myths, contained in those from the earliest historical records and prehistoric symbols discovered through archaeology.

Usually in literature one finds the duration of the procession given as 26000 years, being a rounding of the supposedly more accurate value of 25800 years. In reality the exact duration cannot be given, as the speed of the general precession is a value changing over time. This speed is currently 50.3 arcseconds per year which would mean 25765 years for one cycle to complete, but speeds of 50.25 arcseconds and 50.34 arcseconds, which would lead to the same rounded value of 50.3 arcseconds would result in 25791 and 25744 years, respectively. As such the rounded value of 25800 is understandable.

The precessional speed is increasing currently, and as such, the period is decreasing. Numerical simulations of the solar system over a period of millions of years give a figure of 257 centuries.[1]

Astrologers do not agree, most use a precession rate rounded to 50" per year, to derive a Great Year period of 25920 years. Some, such as Boris Cristoff, the Uruguayan astrologer and author of the book in Spanish "El destino de la Humanidad", prefers to round the age of one sign of the zodiac to 2100 years which equates to a Great Year duration of 25200 years. The Sanskit scholar Swami Sri Yukteswar puts the length of a Great Year at a period of 24,000 years, comprised of one ascending age of 12,000 years and one descending age of 12,000 years. Some scholars believe this measurement serves as the original basis for our current system of daily time; one 24 hour day with one 12 hour period of increasing light (AM) and one 12 hour period of increasing darkness (PM).

In the history of astronomy, a great year may refer to any real or imagined cycle with astronomical or astrological significance. The Greeks sometimes called the period of time required for the naked eye planets to realign, a great year. It was an important concept in ancient Stoicism.

According to Giorgio de Santillana, the former professor of history at MIT, there are over 200 myths or folk stories from over thirty ancient cultures that refer to a Great Year tied to the motion of the heavens. Most of these ancient cultures believed that during the course of one Great Year civilization will rise for about 12,000 years, culminating in a Golden Age, then fall for 12,000 years, culminating in a Dark Age, before rising again. Thus a Great Year is thought to be a cyclical measurement of time with periods of waxing and waning light and darkness similar to the earth's daily and yearly periods of time.

The book, The Great Year, written by Nicholas Campion describes some of the ancient and modern mythology of the Great Year concept. The documentary film, The Great Year, written by Walter Cruttenden and narrated by James Earl Jones describes some of the archaeological and astronomical evidence for the Great Year.

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Re: Great Year ~25,800 years

Post by lvx08 » Thu Feb 08, 2007 2:50 pm

Eccles wrote:The precessional speed is increasing currently, and as such, the period is decreasing. Numerical simulations of the solar system over a period of millions of years give a figure of 257 centuries.[1]
I wonder if this accounts for the widespread perception that time seems to be speeding up.

While on an astronomical topic, here are some truly wonderful pictures from the Hubble telescope. They are big enough to use for yr desktop

http://www.skyimagelab.com/hubphot.html

Enjoy!

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Re: Ramayana

Post by Starlight* » Fri Feb 09, 2007 4:52 am

Thanks for the awesome pictures, Ivx08. I've seenmany of these pictures before. Noticed how many look like an eye.


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Re: Ramayana

Post by Starlight* » Fri Feb 09, 2007 4:59 am

Gopi wrote:The later part of the Ramayana was a precognitive effort by the Author Valmiki, so no one knows for sure what really happened. So we see that the entire epic is based only on a period of 40 years. This leaves a lot more unanswered, about the period, and other civilizations around the world might not have mentioned this extensively. We can only get a connection with the classes of population at the time.
As many are aware the number 40 has great significance. Ex: Moses was 40 when he took the people across to the promise land, it took him 40 years to get there. He was 120 years old when he died. And there's many more.


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Re: Timeline

Post by LoneBear » Fri Feb 09, 2007 1:38 pm

Gopi wrote:That's about 26000 years, btw, does someone have the exact figure for that?
I've always used the Mayan long count value of 9,360,000 days (25,627 years). The Maya were pretty good when it came to calendars.

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The Bridge - Rama setu

Post by Paduwan Sagar » Thu May 15, 2008 9:05 am

Gopi wrote:Rama now arrives with his whole army, crosses the 'ocean' on a bridge made in 5 days, and vanquishes Ravana's place along with Ravana.
The bridge was made up of rocks which actually floated, right?
It is really worth wondering: how could stones float?

Is there really some material on which we can walk and still has density less than water?
I had heard that they floated because they had carved Shri Ram, but that explanation sounds ridiculous.
Could it be possible that someone modified our memory, so that we forgot about the rocks? :D
Adam's bridge is actually the Ram Setu, built by Lord Rama's faithful 'vaanar' soldiers. They say that the structure is man-made and dates back to about 1,700,000 years. That's the tredha yuga, by mythology.
[The faint line between India and Srilanka is seen in the attached pic]
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The Brigde
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Re: Ramayana

Post by Gopi » Thu May 15, 2008 11:42 am

Sagar wrote:It is really worth wondering: how could stones float?
There is a little-known property of water, which increases its density when there is more "prana" moving through. I suspect that this was the same reason that Viktor Schauberger's living water had an abnormally high density and things would float in it where they would sink in case of normal water. An alternative explanation is that the stone structure was changed before using it (making it more like Pumice or something) with certain vibrations.
Sagar wrote:had heard that they floated because they had carved Shri Ram, but that explanation sounds ridiculous.
When you observe that mantras, chants and spells ( Riddikulus! :D ) are the ways in which the cosmic sector is accessed, it actually makes much more sense. This issue of writing the name is most probably a later addition, as I have not seen it in the original Ramayana in Sanskrit.

Still you may find this interesting:

Levitating Stone of Shivapur
Adam's bridge is actually the Ram Setu, built by Lord Rama's faithful 'vaanar' soldiers.
IMHO, this is quite an erroneous identification. The "thin strip" of land is very much dependent on the sea level variation -- a bit higher or lower, and there would be no more 'strip', either a sea or a chain of hills. Plus, the Ramayana states clearly that the bridge was a 100 yojanas in length, and based on the best possible fit, one yojana is nearly 8 miles, at least. You'd more likely end up in Antarctica in the Ancient world if you go that far! The "Raama-setu" is a mere 50 miles.
Sagar wrote:Could it be possible that someone modified our memory, so that we forgot about the rocks?
Interesting that it was Sagara who promised Rama that he would help the rocks float... So you are now remembering the rocks! :)
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Re: The Bridge - Rama setu

Post by LoneBear » Thu May 15, 2008 11:59 am

Paduwan Sagar wrote:
Gopi wrote:Rama now arrives with his whole army, crosses the 'ocean' on a bridge made in 5 days, and vanquishes Ravana's place along with Ravana.
The bridge was made up of rocks which actually floated, right?
It is really worth wondering: how could stones float?
It's just a matter of "density"... if the object weighs less than the water it displaces, it floats. Pumice, a natural volcanic rock, floats in water. Ships, made of steel and aluminum--metal rocks--float in water. Viktor Schauberger could make granite rocks float down water flumes, by controlling the temperature and flow pattern of the water in the flume. Many sands float on water, because the "surface tension" of the water supports them (I quote "surface tension" because the Reciprocal System indicates there is no such concept; just a change in density). Even your body, composed of chemical elements (rocks) and sea water, will float.
Paduwan Sagar wrote:Is there really some material on which we can walk and still has density less than water?
Ever make a log raft? The same technique is used by armies to build bridges in a matter of hours--a series of pontoons connected with metal grating that allows vehicles to be driven across, as it floats on a river. Since the metal grate allows the weight to be distributed over a large area of floatation, it can hold heavy trucks.
Paduwan Sagar wrote:I had heard that they floated because they had carved Shri Ram, but that explanation sounds ridiculous.
There is historical precedence to show that the calling of god's name can invoke super-natural events. St. Francis was noted for flying about the inside of a church in moments of ecstasy (and I mean literally flying, with no devices). I understand that the Siddhis can do similar things.
Paduwan Sagar wrote:Could it be possible that someone modified our memory, so that we forgot about the rocks? :D
In this day and age, your memory was probably modified, but to forget the divine connection in things and see the "science only" viewpoint. After all, the New World Order does not want other gods before them!

But it is an interesting point. Courtesy of those recent "Merlin" dreams I've been having, I am now coming to understand why the Ra refer to this as an "illusion". When I plotted out the concepts using the RS2 concepts (my name for Ancient Science), I discovered that there is a lot more attributed to perception (physical, sensory input) than we realize. The Matrix films are an interesting metaphor of this, and also the basis of "magick", since you don't actually have to manipulate the underlying "reality", itself... just be a magician (like Merlin!) and update the existing illusion. Turning out to be more psychology than physics!
Paduwan Sagar wrote:
Adam's bridge is actually the Ram Setu, built by Lord Rama's faithful 'vaanar' soldiers. They say that the structure is man-made and dates back to about 1,700,000 years. That's the tredha yuga, by mythology.
There are other historical accounts, the Dead Sea Scrolls, for example, that tell of the old days when angels stood along side with men, and even fought in wars. One of the big problems that legacy science has, is that they assume "static" conditions--like a snapshot from a camera. Environment stays the same, nature of people stay the same; the basic conditions change very slowly, if at all.

It is possible that in those days, there was no veil between 3rd and other densities, and some of the feats described were done by entities from higher densities that could be seen and felt. Hence, the carving of a name may connect that rock to a being of another density, altering its physical properties. Our current science can barely figure out 2nd density, let alone 6th!

There are also the potential calendar problems. What constitutes a "year" during those times? The assumption is solar years; Lunar years would reduce it to 60,714 solar years. If they were measured in Plutonian years, that would be only 6,863 Earth years. And then the "start point" needs to be considered. We speak of the year 2008 now, yet the Hebrews claim it is the year 5768. If the "year" was just a day count, like the Mayan Long Count, then it would only have been about 4,654 years ago.

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Re: Ramayana

Post by LoneBear » Thu May 15, 2008 12:23 pm

Gopi wrote:Still you may find this interesting:

Levitating Stone of Shivapur
I found the video of it on YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T_whh8O_EMo


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Re: Ramayana

Post by zenmaster » Fri May 16, 2008 9:47 pm

What is the big deal. The stone appears to weigh about 200lbs. 20lb is trivial to lift over the head.

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Re: Ramayana

Post by Paduwan Sagar » Sat May 17, 2008 2:13 am

zenmaster wrote:What is the big deal. The stone appears to weigh about 200lbs. 20lb is trivial to lift over the head.
They use only their index finger. I bet you couldn't lift 20 lb with only the index finger.


Does anyone know where they quarried this stone from?
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Re: Ramayana

Post by LoneBear » Sat May 17, 2008 12:59 pm

zenmaster wrote:What is the big deal. The stone appears to weigh about 200lbs. 20lb is trivial to lift over the head.
If you read the articles, it states that the stone cannot be lifted by 10 people, or 12+ people... ONLY 11. That's a bit odd unto itself; you would think that it would be easier for 12, if it was just a weight issue.

We used to do something similar when we were kids, where you could get a friend to lay on the ground, and kids would stand around with just their fingertips under, count down and yell something (I don't recall what), and they would just lift right up into the air like they didn't weigh anything. Not sure what the underlying principle is.

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Re: Ramayana

Post by LoneBear » Fri May 23, 2008 6:04 pm

In "A 5000+ Year Old Man Still Physically Alive?" it states:
It was due to the cycle of the yugas, in my opinion. The Bible declares that Methuselah lived for precisely 969 years and then died. From extrapolation, we can also determine that Methuselah lived approximately over some 5000 years ago. This information can be corroborated with certain Vedic literatures with startling parallels being found as a result. For example, it is a Vedic conviction that just over 5000 years ago, the age known as Dwapar Yuga had come to a close. Apparently, it is said that the average lifespan of people during Dwapar Yuga was approximately 1000 years! Methuselah's long lifespan clearly (in a comparative sense anyway, as there are MUCH longer Vedic time-scales still) comes VERY close to 1000 years. Also, the average height of man was said to be taller in the previous yugas. If one reads the Old Testament of the Bible, one will find information that corroborates with the Vedic notion of physically taller humans living in the distant past with its accounts of 'giants' that once roamed the Earth.
Even the Bible refers to the "giants" of the older era, and I do believe they actually found skeletal remains of giants in the 12-15' height range. Somewhere along the line, Ra/Q'uo mentioned that the current human form was created by the Confederation to improve communication for the Martian transplants. I am wondering if these "giants" of the old days were the original Terran form, the advanced stage of Neanderthal man that was the original blueprint for the bipedal form on Earth. It would make sense that the Els, being of similar stature, would create their progeny in their image.

Regarding the ages... I noticed years ago that if you take the Biblical / Yuga lifespans and treat them as lunar years (months) instead of solar years, they just about match our current lifespan. 969 lunar "years" (939 / 13) = 74 solar years. (Lunar orbit takes 28 days, making 13 orbits in a year, not 12 moonths).

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Re: Ramayana

Post by Gopi » Sat May 24, 2008 6:51 am

LoneBear wrote:Even the Bible refers to the "giants" of the older era, and I do believe they actually found skeletal remains of giants in the 12-15' height range.
This process is supposed to happen every time in the Yuga system, and the height of men shrank every Yuga. That is something that has always mystified me, because Hanuman is said to have been sitting under a tree and meditating while the Yuga changed from Treta to Dwapara... and he found the tree and the people had gotten shorter and smaller, a photographic reduction.

I have also heard that the dragonflies millenia ago were around 2 feet big... is its possible that the gravitational effect increases periodically?
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Re: Ramayana

Post by Arcelius » Sat May 24, 2008 3:28 pm

Gopi wrote:
LoneBear wrote:Even the Bible refers to the "giants" of the older era, and I do believe they actually found skeletal remains of giants in the 12-15' height range.
This process is supposed to happen every time in the Yuga system, and the height of men shrank every Yuga. That is something that has always mystified me, because Hanuman is said to have been sitting under a tree and meditating while the Yuga changed from Treta to Dwapara... and he found the tree and the people had gotten shorter and smaller, a photographic reduction.
I assume that Hanuman stayed the same size, otherwise how would he know that things had strunk. Did they become more dense at the same time? Possibly to prepare for fourth density?
Gopi wrote:I have also heard that the dragonflies millenia ago were around 2 feet big... is its possible that the gravitational effect increases periodically?
I went to a geological museum a couple years ago and they had an area set up like a swamp millions of years ago (I forget how many). They had a "dragon fly" there that was about that size.

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Re: Ramayana

Post by LoneBear » Sun May 25, 2008 6:16 pm

Gopi wrote:This process is supposed to happen every time in the Yuga system, and the height of men shrank every Yuga. That is something that has always mystified me, because Hanuman is said to have been sitting under a tree and meditating while the Yuga changed from Treta to Dwapara... and he found the tree and the people had gotten shorter and smaller, a photographic reduction.
What was it, exactly, that changed scale? Humans, animal life, biological life (animal + vegetable), or everything? In The Smoky God, the world of giants has all life gigantic, animals and plants, as well as people.

As we know, "scalar motion" (a change in scale) is the building block of manifestation. It may be possible that, under a certain type of "prana ionization" (like magnetic ionization), there is a quantized change in the overall scale of manifestation. After all, it's all illusion, anyway! But, as Aluxon mentioned, there would have to be an measure outside the system to record the change. For example, if biological life changed scale, and the inanimate realm did not, then the change would be noticed.
Gopi wrote:I have also heard that the dragonflies millenia ago were around 2 feet big... is its possible that the gravitational effect increases periodically?
That's the Meganeura.

Based on RS2 geophysics, the Earth is expanding and constantly adding low-speed matter (the conventional rock), both from within and without. Thus, gravity will increase over time. Lower gravity environments are theorized to have larger creatures, since the weight factor to hold them upright and together is far less. The critters that live in the "space" of the solar neighborhood are enormous in size, some measuring miles across.

Curious bit is that as the solar system ages, the planets get further from the sun, even though both the sun and planets are getting larger. This happens because the core of the sun is in the ultra-high speed range, the range of pulsars, which is basically an anti-gravity engine that works on "scale" -- the sun actually starts to recede from the planets, and when our perception adjusts for the temporal displacement, we see the planets getting further away. That means the years get longer, too.

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Re: Ramayana

Post by Gopi » Sun May 25, 2008 8:35 pm

LoneBear wrote:What was it, exactly, that changed scale? Humans, animal life, biological life (animal + vegetable), or everything?

EVERYTHING. Mountains, trees, and people are all mentioned... so it seems an over all increase in density.

I like that "prana ionization" idea... seems to connect a few things here, and also seems the basis for siddhis.
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Re: Ramayana

Post by LoneBear » Mon May 26, 2008 6:46 pm

Gopi wrote:EVERYTHING. Mountains, trees, and people are all mentioned... so it seems an over all increase in density.
If everything changed scale then the measuring sticks would, too, so how did they tell something was different? Where was the reference measure?

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Re: Ramayana

Post by Gopi » Mon May 26, 2008 7:31 pm

LoneBear wrote:Where was the reference measure?
It was sitting under the tree!! :D
Hanuman remained as he was, being deep in meditation, he hadn't "rescaled". So everything looked smaller, but only to him.
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Re: Ramayana

Post by Paduwan Sagar » Thu May 29, 2008 2:27 am

Gopi wrote:This process is supposed to happen every time in the Yuga system, and the height of men shrank every Yuga.
I always draw small-scale diagrams in Biology exams - when I drew an elephant, it looked like a pig with a trunk when compared to my friends' diagrams! Now if anyone argues about the size, I know of an answer now: "It's a next Yuga species!" :D
LoneBear wrote:It may be possible that, under a certain type of "prana ionization" (like magnetic ionization), there is a quantized change in the overall scale of manifestation. After all, it's all illusion, anyway!
So that's how he used to change his scale, like how he got bigger while crossing the ocean from Mahendra mountain to reach Lanka?
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Re: Ramayana

Post by Gopi » Thu May 29, 2008 10:49 am

Sagar wrote:I always draw small-scale diagrams in Biology exams..."It's a next Yuga species!"
Shows the capacity to concentrate. Tell them you are aiming for a higher density!
Sagar wrote:So that's how he used to change his scale, like how he got bigger while crossing the ocean from Mahendra mountain to reach Lanka?
Yes, only in this instance, he just maintained it at the previous level. Hanuman was well versed with this Siddhi, he is supposed to have used its opposite version (shrinking in size) while sneaking past the guards of the citadel...
It is time.

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Re: Ramayana

Post by LoneBear » Sun Jun 01, 2008 10:23 pm

Gopi wrote:Yes, only in this instance, he just maintained it at the previous level. Hanuman was well versed with this Siddhi, he is supposed to have used its opposite version (shrinking in size) while sneaking past the guards of the citadel...
So, there is an equal probability that Hanuman, while daydreaming, changed HIS size without realizing it, making it appear as the world changed its scale?

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