Fox Network Creating Social Experiment for Utopian Society

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Fox Network Creating Social Experiment for Utopian Society

Post by joeyv23 » Mon Mar 31, 2014 4:39 am

During last night's episode of Cosmos: A Spacetime Odyssey, a promo spot aired that caught my attention in a strong way. According to the promotion, Fox is going to create a social experiment to see if a Utopian society can be built and maintained. I'm going to apply for one of the 15 spots, and as illogical as it is, I wanted to share this with you all and encourage anyone who is a part of Antiquatis, if you meet qualifications (unfortunately, this project is currently only available for US citizens), to apply. Even if I don't get selected, it's my hope that someone who frequents these fora might be selected, because in my humble opinion, if anyone has the potential to create a sustainable community, and maintain it successfully, it's us. The ideals held here of rapport over competition are essential in creating any type of sustainable community.

As of yet, I can't be sure if this is really going to be the year long social experiment that it is claimed to be, and not a new reality tv show aimed at sweeping our goal of creating this type of society under the rug. That being said, I'm applying anyway, because if it does turn out to be the latter, I would like to be there to do my best to correct the situation. I'd like to hear what you all think of this. My main question that isn't answered on the website, is where the funding for the project is going to come from, and if the participants will have access to the outside world, or if they will be thrown into the wilderness and told good luck..


Here's the About section from the site:
Have you ever felt dissatisfied with the society you're living in? Do you have what it takes to create a better one?

FOX’s new unscripted social experiment series “UTOPIA” is searching for candidates to build a whole new world -- just the way they want it! Nationwide casting is now underway. We’re seeking motivated and adventurous pioneers who have the ideas, skills, and determination to create and run their own ideal society.

“UTOPIA” follows 15 inhabitants as they leave their everyday lives to move to an isolated and undeveloped location – for up to an entire year – where they'll create their own world. The series offers imaginative people from across America the chance to be part of a groundbreaking social experiment – the pioneers will make every decision about how they will live, work, and what the rules and laws of “UTOPIA” will be.

CASTING is searching for candidates who are passionate, great at what they do, and also have the problem-solving skills needed for starting up a new society. If you think you have what is takes to create Utopia, then click on the Apply Now button.

Will you be chosen?
Here's the link.. http://utopiatv.com
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Re: Fox Network Creating Social Experiment for Utopian Socie

Post by deepfsh » Mon Mar 31, 2014 5:51 am

I wish you luck. Wasn't the reboot of the Tomorrow People also aired by Fox? If I'm right, according to some users' posts on AQ, there was more fighting and less ethics involved. I don't know if such a reality show has already been done in the past, but it will certainly be a TV broadcast social experiment - and I believe somebody will make a lot of money, I can imagine it's great to capitalize on such a "cool" idea. It reminds me on the show Survivor, which was aired here in Europe when I was in elementary and high school, but the concept of Utopia differs a little bit, since the goal is to create a new civilisation, not just survive in nature.

P.S.: I wasn't impressed by the trailer.
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Re: Fox Network Creating Social Experiment for Utopian Socie

Post by deepfsh » Mon Mar 31, 2014 6:25 am

The above reality show reminded me on a quote I wanted to share some time ago. I think it relates somehow to Fox's project.
Jordan Maxwell wrote:Today we still have a modicum of free speech. But I’ve been told by people high up in the military, and CIA types in the military, the reason why you still have a modicum of free speech and are allowed to talk on the radio and all that kind of thing, is because we want to monitor the American people, to see what they’re thinking. We want to hear radio talk shows, and listen to the people who call into radio talk shows.

Because that tells us how smart Americans are, and shows us what they’re thinking. It’s kind of like keeping a finger on the pulse of America. Just listen to them. If you’re in the FBI or CIA or NSA, National Security Administration, you have whole divisions of people employed to sit and listen to radio, to read books, to read magazines, articles. That’s what they do for a living for the NSA, National Security Administration. It’s called C2 reports.

These people, 24 hours a day, are reading everything, listening to everything, watching all the videos. That’s what they do for the government. And the reason why is, they want to know, how much does the world know? What are they aware of? And who are the talkers, who are people who are waking the people up? We want to know who they are, we want to know what are they talking about, what are they telling the people? And if they know something that’s really important, we need to deal with that right now, immediately.

Source
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Re: Fox Network Creating Social Experiment for Utopian Socie

Post by LoneBear » Mon Mar 31, 2014 2:38 pm

UTOPIA” follows 15 inhabitants as they leave their everyday lives to move to an isolated and undeveloped location...
Now what they don't tell you... "with every move followed by a 40-person camera crew, living in air-conditioned camper trailers grilling steaks and BBQ, roaring generators all night."

Now THAT's isolation, right?

It sounds like yet another "reality show," but I'll bet they do the same thing as they do with other shows--show how it CAN'T work to convince the mindless masses that it's a bad idea. I'll bet that with the opening show, it will be less than 10 minutes before people are yelling at each other or fighting. Good "actors" do not make good "Utopians." Can you just picture 15 people sitting around a campfire, holding philosophical discussions about spirituality, week after week... and the high ratings that would get? :D

But what it DOES tell me is that the concept of an ethical society is hitting hard enough to affect the public at large--hard enough to get the attention of TV producers and governments, alike. (Not that there is much difference... the governments are just the enforcement agencies of the major corporations these days.)

Though if you get selected, Joey, we'll all be rooting for ya!
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Re: Fox Network Creating Social Experiment for Utopian Socie

Post by deepfsh » Mon Mar 31, 2014 4:47 pm

LoneBear wrote:I'll bet that with the opening show, it will be less than 10 minutes before people are yelling at each other or fighting.
Or having sex, romance, whatever. :wink:
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Re: Fox Network Creating Social Experiment for Utopian Socie

Post by Lozion » Mon Mar 31, 2014 7:56 pm

Having worked on 3 isolation type reality shows as a sound engineer, I can tell you the cameras roll 24/7 and on average it takes a full day of raw material to create a 20 minute segment. These shows are created in the editing room. There is no way this Utopia show can be produced (by no less then Fox :? ) without the editorial staff decisions affecting the players to create sellable emotions and situations.

I will NEVER again work on a production like that.
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Re: Fox Network Creating Social Experiment for Utopian Socie

Post by joeyv23 » Mon Mar 31, 2014 9:44 pm

I appreciate all the feedback. After reading the responses here and considering it further, it definitely stands to reason that this is going to be a reality show, geared at making the idea of ethical living look stupid, and considering the fact that I'm not a lightworker, and therefore ok with 'negative' emotions, it's probably best that I stay away from this. It takes a lot to get me hot under the collar, and making light of this dream, seeing that its establishment... or at least introduction is a part of the goals I've set for myself in this life, I wouldn't take too well to being around people who are looking for drama and to pass the idea off to the greater population as stupid and not achievable, and I'd end up getting myself into trouble which is about as counterproductive to the goal as is possible.

The simple fact of the matter is that I'm antsy. I'm beyond ready to leave the confines of this reality to those suited for it, and then a perfect sounding opportunity happens across my awareness, and I jumped up, gung-ho and ready to go. I don't see this opportunity as being as beneficial as I'd hoped it might be, and as such, will leave it be. This isn't for me. I'm not looking for fame or fortune. I want only to be a part of something that is geared towards proving that a peaceful, sustainable life built on rapport is actually possible, and that is exactly what this place is all about, so I'll let Fox have their little reality tv show, and continue working on myself, and working here with you all towards our growth and development, and know that when the time is right, things will fall into place for the Kheb Monastery. THAT is where I want to be, and as antsy as I am to get out of this system and move forward with life, I'm reminded that patience is a big test for me, and if I don't practice it.. I'm not learning it.
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Re: Fox Network Creating Social Experiment for Utopian Socie

Post by LoneBear » Tue Apr 01, 2014 9:49 am

joeyv23 wrote:I want only to be a part of something that is geared towards proving that a peaceful, sustainable life built on rapport is actually possible, and that is exactly what this place is all about, so I'll let Fox have their little reality tv show, and continue working on myself, and working here with you all towards our growth and development, and know that when the time is right, things will fall into place for the Kheb Monastery. THAT is where I want to be, and as antsy as I am to get out of this system and move forward with life, I'm reminded that patience is a big test for me, and if I don't practice it.. I'm not learning it.
That is the way I feel, as well. I have tried to build the monastery on a number of occasions, only to find out that it has to be an effort of multiple people making the choice to work together in rapport, each with their unique talents and skills. It doesn't work as a "business" hiring employees and opening to the public, like many such places end up being (including churches).

What made it "click" for me was an old musical, Lost Horizon, which I went to see with my family back in 1973 on the "big screen." It is the story of a remote valley in the Himalayas (Valley of Blue Moon) and the lamasery of Shangri-la. Some 2000 people lived in that valley in total rapport, and what impressed me was when Chang was explaining to Conway what their "rules" were... simply "be kind."

Each of the characters comes to the valley, pretty burned out by life. All but one finds resolution by finding their purpose in life again, which results in embracing the philosophy of Shangri-la, compassion, moderation and kindness. The one exception was the young newspaper reporter, brother to Conway, that could not live without the distractions of the fast-paced lifestyle of the city. After all this time, it still remains one of my favorite films and books.

When Lost Horizon was published back in 1933, it was a major best seller--so much so, that it was selected as the first book to be put into the new "paperback" format. It says much about how society has changed since then. When I was young, "kindness" was still around, and that is how I was raised. You help little old ladies across the street and they appreciate that kindness. These days, if you tried to help a little old lady across the street, you'd get whacked with a pocketbook and hit with pepper spray while she yells "rape!" Kindness requires a degree of trust, and there is very little trust in a world that is based on deception. People do not appreciate "acts of kindness" any more, as is evidenced by most insult-based fora and blogs on the internet. When someone replies, they are taking time out of their life to help someone else--that should be appreciated, whether you agree with the comments or not. (And I am not talking about saying "thank you," which these days has become an "opt out" so you don't actually have to do anything. For me, I get the sense of appreciation when someone uses information I've posted to improve their lives, or help improve the lives of others. Then I know it didn't just "stop" at the end of the message--"kindness" spread a bit more.)

I'll make this one, little suggestion, that you'll never find on a FOX interview... don't be pushed forward by anxiety--be pulled forward by acts of kindness and compassion.
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Re: Fox Network Creating Social Experiment for Utopian Socie

Post by aaron » Tue Apr 01, 2014 1:02 pm

I wish it weren't so, but right off the bat, my intuition tells me this is but an attempt to ultimately dis-credit any idea or effort to create such a society.

I watched the trailer just to make sure I had the idea of what they were trying to do, and its all about TV. In fact they even say in the trailer that the goal is to produce a great TV show.

Throughout the trailer they are already introducing the idea of money and how will they create it,etc... (notice that the subliminal suggestion is that "money" is still a default necessity)

There are also many contexts missing. The idea of a "survivor" type show comes to mind certainly under the context of "living on nothing" which of course results in merely "survival". So for me the context of building any "rapport" society, or otherwise is also dependent on resources to do so. What kind of materials and skilled labor will be available? Will they be free to develop any technologies they see fit? How about apply them? Will they have free and unfettered access to any and all resources necessary to achieve such?

A lot could be done to build any kind of society if the right resources and labor to create them are available in abundance and under "uncommitted investigation". Question is- will this show, and its participants have all the necessary elements and support to achieve this? Will they even be encouraged to do this under such freedom and autonomy? I think not.

A year is nowhere near long enough to get an effective data sampling of such a project. Another indicator that its just meant to be "complex entertainment".

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Re: Fox Network Creating Social Experiment for Utopian Socie

Post by aaron » Tue Apr 01, 2014 2:40 pm

Additionally, this show makes me think its an experiment to measure the response, capabilities, and acceptance of the muggles in a "lights out" situation.

Has anyone here seen or followed the current TV series called "Revolution"? This show I feel is another example of the elites disclosing and hinting at plans they have. This show revolution even has the all seeing eye pyramid symbol throughout and denotes the secret society behind the reformed "United States".

So think about what happens in the show revolution. 100's of quadrillions of nanotech "nanites" in everything and everywhere (kinda makes one wonder if chem-trails are actually spraying nanites everywhere) have been programmed to absorb all electricity and self replicate. So we have an "Armageddon" type scenario whereas there is no more electric power on Earth, and immediately the planet is plunged into darkness and "survival of the fittest" mode.

look at what is revealed in several of the show's narratives:

- a post apocalyptic world where everything starts over without electricity, governments,etc...
- a rivalrous "kill or be killed" theme, which completely ignores any idea or suggestion that this is the perfect opportunity to re-create anything is a rapport based society, but instead of working together to find better solutions for energy, medicine, food, or new non electric technologies; its spend all your time and energy competing for the very finite amounts of "old" commodities that still remain until exhausted.
- a "new" United States emerges (from where nobody knows, but they re-appear one day complete with structured army and apparently were able to hide out underground somewhere until the right time to "Save America") to bring order to the chaos, complete with upper echelon members that are all part of a secret society complete with illuminati eye symbolism and secret communications written in ancient Arabic...?
- this new United States considers the blackout a necessity and served as a great way to weed out all the undesirables. And for the ones that still exist, they simply kill them off with "faked and engineered plagues" that of course they have themselves have vaccine's for. This new United States also comes prepared with re-education camps for the youth, and psychological torture training to create new alto ego super soldiers that will follow any command from secret "psycho triggers".
-oh, and its discovered later, that this same new United Sates were behind the entire black out all along.

*My gut is telling me that a "Utopia" TV show like this, is a further mind control experiment, aimed at gauging the public's acceptance of such narratives, AND to discredit any contrary narrative by seeking to reenforce the idea that such a society is not possible. To me, the real objective is to "pre-program" the muggles that in such a "lights out" situation, they need to compete and kill each other over scarce commodities, instead of re-creating a society that makes the "elites" obsolete. Hierarchical societies cannot exist without rivalry competition.

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Re: Fox Network Creating Social Experiment for Utopian Socie

Post by deepfsh » Tue Apr 01, 2014 4:58 pm

LoneBear wrote:TPTB are actually the Merchant class of people (see the section on Utopian Ideals on the Monastery).
You wrote this on another thread, but I think I should reply to it here. I read that section and when I got to this paragraph -
Peasants, without status or role and trapped in an urban environment still need to eat and live and turn to crime to obtain the essentials of life. Unlike their ancestors, the urban peasant class has no familiarity with the land (or nature) and cannot survive on their own outside the urban areas,[1]
- it reminded me on these same words said by Leo Zagami (a member of the Italian nobility) towards the end of this interview, which I listened to last year. When I heard him saying that, it really made me think. Since I live in the countryside, but attended all the schools and university in cities, and lived for a few years in the city center of our capitol, I completely agree with the above-mentioned statement. It's worrying, to say the least.

I find it interesting how Zagami also said that the merchant class (ala Berlusconi), which subjugated the nobility, is guilty of all this debauchery and turbo capitalism in the world, and that the royalty should regain its noble/prominent role in the society. Same pasta, different sauce, I would say.
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Re: Fox Network Creating Social Experiment for Utopian Socie

Post by PeacefulMe » Wed Apr 02, 2014 8:33 am

Has anyone heard of Ubuntu Contributionism and Michael Tellinger? He has a project in South Africa where he is working on creating a way of life where everyone contributes to the society, much like the utopian ideas. They are accepting volunteers to help in specific areas of the community (e.g., organic farming, building). This may be more along the lines of what you, Joeyv23, is looking for. Forget any shows on TV…you know how they all turn out, especially 'reality' shows. There isn't much reality in them :wink:

Here is link to the volunteer section for the Ubuntu project, but you can read more about the entire idea throughout the website: http://www.ubuntuparty.org.za/p/plan-of-action.html

Here is another link as well, that goes into more detail about Michael Tellinger: http://www.michaeltellinger.com/index.php

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Re: Fox Network Creating Social Experiment for Utopian Socie

Post by joeyv23 » Wed Apr 02, 2014 8:43 am

PeacefulMe wrote:Has anyone heard of Ubuntu Contributionism and Michael Tellinger? He has a project in South Africa where he is working on creating a way of life where everyone contributes to the society, much like the utopian ideas. They are accepting volunteers to help in specific areas of the community (e.g., organic farming, building). This may be more along the lines of what you, Joeyv23, is looking for. Forget any shows on TV…you know how they all turn out, especially 'reality' shows. There isn't much reality in them :wink:

Here is link to the volunteer section for the Ubuntu project, but you can read more about the entire idea throughout the website: http://www.ubuntuparty.org.za/p/plan-of-action.html

Here is another link as well, that goes into more detail about Michael Tellinger: http://www.michaeltellinger.com/index.php
Thank you PeacefulMe!!! I'm giving this a serious look, I definitely qualify for one of the needed positions as a natural builder/handyman, just gotta dig in deeper and send an application. I have to go to sleep now though, so it has to wait for a few hours at least :)
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Re: Fox Network Creating Social Experiment for Utopian Socie

Post by PeacefulMe » Wed Apr 02, 2014 9:19 am

joeyv23 wrote:Thank you PeacefulMe!!! I'm giving this a serious look, I definitely qualify for one of the needed positions as a natural builder/handyman, just gotta dig in deeper and send an application. I have to go to sleep now though, so it has to wait for a few hours at least :)
Best of luck to you and many blessings! May you find what you are searching for and please keep us posted :D

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Re: Fox Network Creating Social Experiment for Utopian Socie

Post by Lozion » Wed Apr 02, 2014 11:15 am

Found this update:

http://www.ubuntuparty.org.za/2014/03/s ... pdate.html

I'm also exploring the Ubuntu project. :)
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Re: Fox Network Creating Social Experiment for Utopian Socie

Post by PeacefulMe » Wed Apr 02, 2014 2:53 pm

Lozion wrote:I'm also exploring the Ubuntu project. :)
You may be a shoe-in considering you're 'in the area' :wink: Best of luck to you as well!

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Re: Fox Network Creating Social Experiment for Utopian Socie

Post by Lozion » Wed Apr 02, 2014 4:10 pm

PeacefulMe wrote:
Lozion wrote:I'm also exploring the Ubuntu project. :)
You may be a shoe-in considering you're 'in the area' :wink: Best of luck to you as well!
Heh. Actually, I'm about to leave Africa for various reasons (ebola outbreak among others) and will go back to Canada for awhile although the Ubuntu project is really interesting. Who knows, I may just go to SA some time later though Panama is starting to sound real good too... :wink:
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Re: Fox Network Creating Social Experiment for Utopian Socie

Post by deepfsh » Wed Apr 02, 2014 6:31 pm

PeacefulMe wrote:Has anyone heard of Ubuntu Contributionism and Michael Tellinger?
I see they also have serious political ambitions - I wish them all the best, and I hope they really "made their homework", as Maxwell would say. When you go against the banksters and the system of law, you better keep in mind the saying "knowledge is power", IMHO.

On the other hand, I don't know why there's the necessity to make a logo which is Egyptian in nature (winged disk), connected to the mystery schools - at least I perceive it like this. It's a recurring symbol. Do we really have to keep repeating it after all those millennia? If I understand it correctly, it's just the symbol for the Sun. (BTW, I think now I understand why you chose such a logo for AQ - it's those 4 Greek letters which you mentioned in your answer to my post. It's like the beginning and ending of a journey.)

"The Liberation Movement"? A "New World"? We heard this term many times, and I know now that the "new" world, as also LoneBear wrote on AQ, is really the continuation of the old one. I wouldn't use that term myself - unless they did it for "political" reasons.
We have space for 12 people to come and join us helping to build the first UBUNTU community. Although we have received over 200 applications, many of them were not clear and many were misguided - so please read carefully below.
Yeah, a lot of misunderstandings can occur when you go public from the start with such a project. Like I (/Adidas) said, "impossible is nothing", but it's not easy to accomplish.
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Re: Fox Network Creating Social Experiment for Utopian Socie

Post by Lozion » Wed Apr 02, 2014 8:30 pm

deepfsh wrote: On the other hand, I don't know why there's the necessity to make a logo which is Egyptian in nature (winged disk), connected to the mystery schools - at least I perceive it like this. It's a recurring symbol. Do we really have to keep repeating it after all those millennia? If I understand it correctly, it's just the symbol for the Sun.
Sumerian actually. I too find that a bit odd. Much like the Eceti logo (http://www.eceti.org/EcetiUpLeftDark.gif)
Tellinger is very Annunaki knowledgeable so it may infer either that his movement furthers liberation from the grasp of our "old friends or, like you say is a continuation of the Old ways? Confusing...
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Re: Fox Network Creating Social Experiment for Utopian Socie

Post by joeyv23 » Thu Apr 03, 2014 12:00 am

Now that I'm taking a look at it, for starters, the winged disk symbol.. that it's Annunaki is one thing.. but the fact that the white hand has more of a grasp on the situation than the dark hand.. if they were balanced, touching tip to tip, I would be ok with it, but just by looking at their symbol, I can already see that they are unbalanced towards the light. Then when reading through some info about it, even though it's good to talk about the subjugation that we've gone through in order to wake people up, to continue calling the people working in politics 'crooks' and therefore setting themselves up as being better than... is not rapport based living in practice.
ubuntuhomepage wrote:The concept of Contributionism first emerged in 2005 out of the research into ancient human history and how civilisation has morphed over thousands of years. It also became clear that all ancient cultures embraces a philosophy that was virtually identical in order to survive as isolated communities. This is the philosophy of UBUNTU, or what I originally called Contributionism.

It can be described as follow: “If it’s not good for everyone, it’s no good at all."I urge you to read as much as you can on our website to inform yourself and realise how simple it really is. I urge you to set aside any pre-conceived ideas of how it may resemble other systems and jump to conclusions before you have absorbed the simple basic fundamentals of this beautiful way of life that is intended to allow every human being to thrive and enjoy life to their fullest potential. Without the draconian rules and restrictions that have been imposed on humanity everywhere today by those that are supposed to serve us – the people.
Not digging it.. "If it's not good for everyone, it's no good at all." Umm.... no?

Also, "those that are supposed to serve us". Ideally we shouldn't have to have others serving us.
ubuntuhomepage wrote:Every socio-political system we have ever had as the human race has failed us dramatically."


They exclude that failure is opportunity for further growth and development.
ubuntuhomepage wrote:The South African economy and natural resources have been plundered by greedy international corporations, supported by reckless and ignorant politicians, with no remorse or any real accountability to its citizens.

More competitive dialogue setting themselves up as being better than those that came before. I don't look at those who have been working in systems that we would consider corrupted as being 'wrong' or less than anyone else, so much as they are living out their own personal purpose. It's always a matter of perspective, and it seems to me that this group is established in it's narrow perspective that what has happened to us is "bad" and that we must build something "good". The way I see it, what has happened has happened. Regardless of how anyone perceives it or labels it as good or bad, we are where we are, so to me, if this project were to be successful in the long run, it would have to have not been founded on us vs them principles.
Ubuntu Party Constitution wrote:All people shall have equal right to use their own languages, and to develop their own culture and customs as long as it does not infringe on the customs of others.
I believe in freedom to the point of infringing on the freedom of others, but to say that culture can be developed as long as it doesn't infringe on another's customs isn't quite the same and doesn't sit well with me. Tiptoeing through tulips comes to mind.
Ubuntu Party Constitution wrote:Imprisonment shall be only for serious crimes against the people, and shall aim at re-education, not vengeance



Wouldn't rehabilitation be better than re-education? I guess these could be synonymous, but I have a connotation to re-education that isn't so friendly. This also means they expect they'll still have to deal with serious crimes against the community, it's almost the same in my mind as submitting to defeat (unless the goal is not what it's claimed to be) before the project was even started. Not saying there won't be conflicts in the future, just that in a community where everyone is working together for the benefit of self and all others involved, there wouldn't be people in the mix that would commit serious crimes.

I think I've seen enough of this to realize that while it's very close to what I'm looking for, their ideals don't match with those that we share here, unless I've misinterpreted what's between the lines.
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Re: Fox Network Creating Social Experiment for Utopian Socie

Post by PeacefulMe » Thu Apr 03, 2014 1:15 am

Wow, I wasn't expecting such a negative spin and over-analyzation of what Ubuntu stands for. Does not any of what they are trying to do resonate in a positive light with any of you? To see how it went from such a positive sounding thing to something that seems more sinister is making me understand how I am struggling with living from my heart and not from my head. I tend to over-think and over-analyze practically every decision I need to make in my life and now I see I'm not the only one :wink: I didn't analyze every word on the Ubuntu website and I didn't see their logo as something negative and SM-related. I read enough to make me feel as though this group is on to something…something positive. And it makes me want to ask the question that has been on my mind since I first read Daniel's papers…when does rapport begin? How can we live in rapport when we live as slaves to TPTB? To live in rapport means not to fight, period. No fighting the system, no fighting the injustices. So, what…is rapport selective? The Ubuntu philosophy can't be rapport based because they're bucking the system? Because they're calling out the governments for what they really are? Do the LMs really live in rapport, considering that they went to war with the SMs? Seems like a double standard to me. But maybe I'm not as far along on the path as others seem to be and I just don't understand rapport. I'm trying to understand this and so many other things. Michael Tellinger seems to know a great deal about our true history and to me, that says a great deal. Yet what I'm sensing from these responses is that he's probably a puppet for TPTB. I don't mean to get defensive, you are all wonderful people and have so much to offer me and each and everyone of us that is part of this fora, but I would like to understand. Does there always need to be a devil's advocate? Or maybe these responses are simply misinterpreted information from the Ubuntu webpage.
joeyv23 wrote:Also, "those that are supposed to serve us". Ideally we shouldn't have to have others serving us.
They are referring to government…government rules and restrictions that have been imposed on humanity…governments are supposed to serve us, the people…that's why we 'elect' them into office. I do not believe that their philosophy is to create a new 'government' to serve anyone. Their philosophy sounds pretty utopian to me.
joeyv23 wrote:
ubuntuhomepage wrote:Every socio-political system we have ever had as the human race has failed us dramatically."


They exclude that failure is opportunity for further growth and development.
ubuntuhomepage wrote:The South African economy and natural resources have been plundered by greedy international corporations, supported by reckless and ignorant politicians, with no remorse or any real accountability to its citizens.

More competitive dialogue setting themselves up as being better than those that came before. I don't look at those who have been working in systems that we would consider corrupted as being 'wrong' or less than anyone else, so much as they are living out their own personal purpose. It's always a matter of perspective, and it seems to me that this group is established in it's narrow perspective that what has happened to us is "bad" and that we must build something "good". The way I see it, what has happened has happened. Regardless of how anyone perceives it or labels it as good or bad, we are where we are, so to me, if this project were to be successful in the long run, it would have to have not been founded on us vs them principles.
How is that dialogue setting them up as being better than those that came before? The situation in SA is no different than the situation in the USA, or anywhere else in the world considering that TPTB run everything. I don't see that they are founding their movement on us vs. them principles. This particular project is SA-specific, but it's meant to be something that can be applied everywhere…they're setting the bar, now it's up to every other country to follow or maybe even raise the bar.

Sorry JoeyV…don't mean to pick only your quotes to question…it's late (or very early) and I'm tired :)

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Re: Fox Network Creating Social Experiment for Utopian Socie

Post by joeyv23 » Thu Apr 03, 2014 1:48 am

PeacefulMe wrote:Wow, I wasn't expecting such a negative spin and over-analyzation of what Ubuntu stands for. Does not any of what they are trying to do resonate in a positive light with any of you? To see how it went from such a positive sounding thing to something that seems more sinister is making me understand how I am struggling with living from my heart and not from my head. I tend to over-think and over-analyze practically every decision I need to make in my life and now I see I'm not the only one :wink: I didn't analyze every word on the Ubuntu website and I didn't see their logo as something negative and SM-related. I read enough to make me feel as though this group is on to something…something positive. And it makes me want to ask the question that has been on my mind since I first read Daniel's papers…when does rapport begin? How can we live in rapport when we live as slaves to TPTB? To live in rapport means not to fight, period. No fighting the system, no fighting the injustices. So, what…is rapport selective? The Ubuntu philosophy can't be rapport based because they're bucking the system? Because they're calling out the governments for what they really are? Do the LMs really live in rapport, considering that they went to war with the SMs? Seems like a double standard to me. But maybe I'm not as far along on the path as others seem to be and I just don't understand rapport. I'm trying to understand this and so many other things. Michael Tellinger seems to know a great deal about our true history and to me, that says a great deal. Yet what I'm sensing from these responses is that he's probably a puppet for TPTB. I don't mean to get defensive, you are all wonderful people and have so much to offer me and each and everyone of us that is part of this fora, but I would like to understand. Does there always need to be a devil's advocate? Or maybe these responses are simply misinterpreted information from the Ubuntu webpage.

They are referring to government…government rules and restrictions that have been imposed on humanity…governments are supposed to serve us, the people…that's why we 'elect' them into office. I do not believe that their philosophy is to create a new 'government' to serve anyone. Their philosophy sounds pretty utopian to me.
There is a constitution, which says that there will be laws. If there are laws, then there would have to be ways to enforce the laws, and even if people are actually getting more of a say in the process than we are now, it doesn't change the fact that you can have one small voice to which a certain law shouldn't apply, but because majority has decided, this one small person is now being governed by the people making the rule.

Also, my issue with their logo isn't it's origin. At all. It's in the logo itself. The light hand is shown more than the dark hand. This show imbalance towards the light. Been there, done that, not trying to do it again.
PeacefulMe wrote:
joeyv23 wrote:More competitive dialogue setting themselves up as being better than those that came before. I don't look at those who have been working in systems that we would consider corrupted as being 'wrong' or less than anyone else, so much as they are living out their own personal purpose. It's always a matter of perspective, and it seems to me that this group is established in it's narrow perspective that what has happened to us is "bad" and that we must build something "good". The way I see it, what has happened has happened. Regardless of how anyone perceives it or labels it as good or bad, we are where we are, so to me, if this project were to be successful in the long run, it would have to have not been founded on us vs them principles.
How is that dialogue setting them up as being better than those that came before? The situation in SA is no different than the situation in the USA, or anywhere else in the world considering that TPTB run everything. I don't see that they are founding their movement on us vs. them principles. This particular project is SA-specific, but it's meant to be something that can be applied everywhere…they're setting the bar, now it's up to every other country to follow or maybe even raise the bar.


"They" are bad, "they" are crooks, "we" are good, and "we" have it figured out, not "them". Is that not us vs them??

Also, because it's occurring in SA, doesn't mean to me that it's a project specifically OF South Africans. It shouldn't be up the any other country to raise the bar. Think about this.. what exactly IS a country?

This is about presentation. The language is absolutely key in understanding the motives of a project. I don't feel like I over analyzed (I'm an expert at over analyzing), I scanned over the home page, and then their declaration, and in that scan saw the points that I posted here pop out at me.
PeacefulMe wrote:Sorry JoeyV…don't mean to pick only your quotes to question…it's late (or very early) and I'm tired :)
You've not done me any harm or disservice, so your apology was unnecessary, but it is accepted nonetheless. << Please don't take that the wrong way, I just have a thing about the incessant need to apologize when nothing 'wrong' has occurred, and especially doing it in advance lol. And I feel you on the being tired thing! 3 more hours on graveyard shift and then I get to hit the hay :)
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Re: Fox Network Creating Social Experiment for Utopian Socie

Post by joeyv23 » Thu Apr 03, 2014 3:46 am

I've thought about it, and even though the Ubuntu project isn't EXACTLY what I'm looking for, I feel like it wouldn't hurt to apply, and if accepted take a 2 month trip to SA. If nothing else, I can learn a few things about the project and carry that forward into the future to different endeavors. And while I see it as being unbalanced towards the light.. there are worse things a group could be, I'll just have to keep my wits about me. It's easy to fall into the love and light way of life. Not knocking it, I've just moved on from it and have no desire to go back to that.
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Re: Fox Network Creating Social Experiment for Utopian Socie

Post by PeacefulMe » Thu Apr 03, 2014 5:17 am

joeyv23 wrote:Also, my issue with their logo isn't it's origin. At all. It's in the logo itself. The light hand is shown more than the dark hand. This show imbalance towards the light. Been there, done that, not trying to do it again.
Have you ever thought about that this way…the fingers of the two hands in their logo are intertwined holding the earth and one finger, either white or black, is going to be first in this 1D drawing? It's all a matter of perspective. You can either see imbalance, or you can see perfect balance…it's your choice. If the fingers are intertwined, the black finger is going to be the finger on the outside on the back of this drawing, so to speak. They can't please all of the people all of the time, but I think they're doing their best :wink:

I, myself, am working toward the light and love at this point in my journey. Yet, I am also trying to balance that with everything I have learned from CH and Antiquatis. Those things seem to be at odds with each other…light and love in comparison with science and knowledge. I have been struggling with all of it together as when I get comfortable with the light and love concepts, something from CH or Antiquatis make me question and sometimes doubt them. I'm trying to get my head (ego/mind) and my heart (intuition/feeling) to work together, not against each other. What I saw in the posts from this thread after you and Lozion were, in my opinion, intuitively comfortable with the idea presented by Ubuntu, was that a small seed of doubt was planted and your ego/mind stepped in and started making you analyze the concepts and doubt what you originally thought/felt as something you really wanted to do. I think analyzing and questioning things are important parts of growing, but sometimes you just need to let go and have faith (and that, I know, is a big lesson for me!).

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Re: Fox Network Creating Social Experiment for Utopian Socie

Post by joeyv23 » Thu Apr 03, 2014 7:12 am

PeacefulMe wrote:
joeyv23 wrote:Also, my issue with their logo isn't it's origin. At all. It's in the logo itself. The light hand is shown more than the dark hand. This show imbalance towards the light. Been there, done that, not trying to do it again.
Have you ever thought about that this way…the fingers of the two hands in their logo are intertwined holding the earth and one finger, either white or black, is going to be first in this 1D drawing? It's all a matter of perspective. You can either see imbalance, or you can see perfect balance…it's your choice. If the fingers are intertwined, the black finger is going to be the finger on the outside on the back of this drawing, so to speak. They can't please all of the people all of the time, but I think they're doing their best :wink:

I, myself, am working toward the light and love at this point in my journey. Yet, I am also trying to balance that with everything I have learned from CH and Antiquatis. Those things seem to be at odds with each other…light and love in comparison with science and knowledge. I have been struggling with all of it together as when I get comfortable with the light and love concepts, something from CH or Antiquatis make me question and sometimes doubt them. I'm trying to get my head (ego/mind) and my heart (intuition/feeling) to work together, not against each other. What I saw in the posts from this thread after you and Lozion were, in my opinion, intuitively comfortable with the idea presented by Ubuntu, was that a small seed of doubt was planted and your ego/mind stepped in and started making you analyze the concepts and doubt what you originally thought/felt as something you really wanted to do. I think analyzing and questioning things are important parts of growing, but sometimes you just need to let go and have faith (and that, I know, is a big lesson for me!).
At first, I was excited at the prospect of being shown another project for an attempt at sustainable living. I understand it may be something, if not confusing, that I'd be willing to make a decision simply based on their logo, but I've learned to trust my intuition, and I don't feel like they're trying so much to please people with their logo, as much as it's a visual representation of the statement the organization is trying to make. I see it, and yes, because there's more white finger than black finger, I feel that the statement is 'More Light'. It may seem arbitrary, or even silly of me to make a decision based on this, but that's what I've done. It's just as you said, a matter of perspective. To me, it's also a matter of choice.

I was a lightworker. I'll tell you from experience, there is nothing quite like the high that comes from being high on happy. And there's nothing wrong with it, for me it was needed, so that I'd be able to relay this exact information. If you're choosing a side, that's fine, because it's your choice to make. I realized that choosing the light over the dark was not balance. You may hear that you have to love negative emotions out of existence, but that, for me at least, doesn't work. I see "negative" emotions are teachers. The ego, while it does need in most cases some tempering since we live in a society that promotes ego living and creates an imbalance, is not something that has to be gotten rid of. If it weren't for ego, we wouldn't be the unique individuals that we are. I'd take this logic into '5d' chat rooms, and without fail I would have "light"workers attacking me and calling me a paid shill. It didn't feel like an illogical query, so the reaction I received wasn't what I'd expected from a group of such loving people. I could leave and come back later, and as long as it was all happy, happy, happy, love, love, <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3's all over the place, all was good.

Please don't take my experience as an attempt to dissuade you from taking the path of Light and Love. If that's where you feel you need to be, then be there with all of your heart. Just remember, always to think for yourself and question everything. There is so much information out there, and a lot of it feels really really good, but never doubt any little signal in you that says "Wait a second.."

Something I feel that I benefited from being a lightworker was teaching myself to feel unconditional love for all beings. That lasts in me today. I feel like the natural emotive state of this being that we are, the Logos, Intelligent Infinity, God, Goddess, the All, or whatever else anyone wants to refer to it as, is that of unconditional love. This doesn't mean that we're being neglected when things are going wrong. It means we love what we are so much, that we are willing to allow our selves to learn the hard lesson. I've also learned that even though I love everything for existing, I don't have to like it all. And because of this, I'm working to educate myself so that when the time comes and things fall into place, and it feels right, and I know it's the right thing for me, I'll go in with everything that I am. The prospect of the Kheb Monastery feels right. Until then, if I can take part in other projects, get out of this small town bubble again and do with my life what I'm driven to do.. work on rapport based, sustainable living communities that aren't governed by society at large, then I will absolutely throw myself in headfirst, and soak in the experience.

I've written you what feels like a novel, so I'll leave you with this and then I'm headed to time/space. I've had faith, now I have confidence :) I wish you fare travels on your journey. Much love! _/|\_
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