Independent Thought Discussion

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Independent Thought Discussion

Post by Andrew » Wed Dec 06, 2017 7:01 pm

(Split from Poll question as it concerns a variety of other topics that appear to be far off the topic. LB)
tymeflyz wrote:
Wed Dec 06, 2017 3:03 pm
No, I can't think about this question {it enrages me}
i'm guessing I will be the only one to use this anwser ; [
Amalgamation exercises, like the couple described in Bruce's Magnum Opus papers, are useful in loosening up blockages in one's energy system. I find closing one's eyes to be necessary in doing these kinds of exercises, because your dreams, desires and past experiences all embed themselves into your the cosmic body over time and become distorted into complexes. Closing your eyes helps bypass the ego, which has been tuned by solely material sector perceptions to this point. It's fine to feel anger and frustration when asked to dig deeper into oneself for more honesty, but be proactive and clear that energy or contemplate what that energy blockage is trying to say. Why are you angry?

Trust me. It used to get angry quite often in the middle of my energy clearing sessions, but if you imagine your energy system as a car that has been running for years without an oil change and you're just now getting around to doing something about it, it's not going to be an easy task. You're gonna have a heck of a lot of clogs that have hardened over the years that need softening before they can be broken up and flushed out. Cleaning it all out doesn't happen with one pump. You gotta keep going at it if you really want yourself to run clean and easily.
LoneBear wrote: I would like to know what I am doing wrong?
joeyv23 wrote:Nothing
Sure. This site may be doing nothing wrong, but it could be better! The highest form of social impulses are the ones that excite the credenciveness phreno-organ. Mark Passio, a lecturer I've mentioned a few times on here, has great, cold and rational, well thought-out presentations on natural law and various other occult topics. But besides just providing his logically deduced knowledge base, he transfers a chord of seriousness, of imminent and persistent threat that is happening right now, and his content one-by-one shows you where he's coming from. He may deliver his material with vitriol at times, but the impression I was always left with, and the others I've talked to at one of his presentations, was that he's the speaker you come to see, because (from what I see now) his assertions stimulate passions that make you want to take action! It's empowering. That's everything the credenciveness behavior-organ is meant to stimulate: you into power.

The way I see it, if Antiquatis is supposed to materialize into a school of Reciprocal systems and magick study, there better be real magick going on in that school or its a fraud. The defining agent in any separate organ-ization is power. Is capability. Contractors organize to build buildings. Dark occultists organize to get others to do their work for them so they can rule the world. If you don't have any power, you organize into Anti-Fa and other communist organizations. Aspiring witches and wizards organize to.... study and do magick. By the very visualization of one doing magick from any fantasy, fiction or mythical tale, it involves a degree of assertion.

Looking around Antiquatis, I'm looking at a giant library, and that poll is just one of the books down one of the aisles.

Is there any way to feature a thread on the main page? Stick it there? Make it stand out? That may help get responses. By emphasizing a point of focus.
Danny boy is getting in the mood to write something, but does not know what to write on. Was considering a paper on wizardry, but unsure if people are ready for something like that. As Doctor Who (Pat Troughton) said, "give a monkey control of his environment and he'll fill the world with bananas!" So if you have specific suggestions, let him know over on ConsciousHugs.
If Danny is concerned we're not going to carry on with his work, I understand. It's a difficult task being on the outskirts of a society we don't even want to be a part of anymore, as a species are physically separate from, and yet have to interact with for survival and helping others that are evolving the same. The bananas don't sound bad to me. We that have been studying have been growing ethically, naturally, and handing out wizarding 101 pamphlets 1.) isn't going to hurt us, and 2.) is sort of like a code in itself, so that if a muggle ever got a hold of it, it's not like he'd be able to all of a sudden conjure all the bananas and flamethrowers he'd want now without deep understanding of self anyway.

What's proof is that danny's knowledge in the area would go to waste should he ascend and we'd have to carve our own paths. Though I am definitely on the path of success, it would take longer without the headmaster's faith and assistance.
"Classical historians traditionally dismiss tales of magic as unworthy of scholarly attention, but to us any mention of a witch's broomstick or wizard's wand evokes the smell of a scientist's laboratory." The Sphinx and the Megaliths

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Re: Are People Still Capable of Independent Thought?

Post by joeyv23 » Wed Dec 06, 2017 8:14 pm

Andrew wrote:
Wed Dec 06, 2017 7:01 pm
tymeflyz wrote:
Wed Dec 06, 2017 3:03 pm
No, I can't think about this question {it enrages me}
i'm guessing I will be the only one to use this anwser ; [
Amalgamation exercises, like the couple described in Bruce's Magnum Opus papers, are useful in loosening up blockages in one's energy system. I find closing one's eyes to be necessary in doing these kinds of exercises, because your dreams, desires and past experiences all embed themselves into your the cosmic body over time and become distorted into complexes. Closing your eyes helps bypass the ego, which has been tuned by solely material sector perceptions to this point. It's fine to feel anger and frustration when asked to dig deeper into oneself for more honesty, but be proactive and clear that energy or contemplate what that energy blockage is trying to say. Why are you angry?
I've found it useful when working on things such as this to withdraw the projection and ask... What is it within myself that I am dissatisfied with that this external situation reflects enough to engage the reaction?
LoneBear wrote: I would like to know what I am doing wrong?
joeyv23 wrote:Nothing
Sure. This site may be doing nothing wrong, but it could be better!
The question wasn't about what the site was doing wrong but what Bruce was doing wrong. That said, I don't think the site is lacking as is. I can understand frustration that people aren't actively engaging as they once did, but we're not them/then. That may sound cold, but that's the reality of the situation. A person can't be forced to engage if they aren't themselves compelled to do so.

Mark Passio, a lecturer I've mentioned a few times on here, has great, cold and rational, well thought-out presentations on natural law and various other occult topics. But besides just providing his logically deduced knowledge base, he transfers a chord of seriousness, of imminent and persistent threat that is happening right now, and his content one-by-one shows you where he's coming from.
Therein you can see where he is still hooked into the system.
He may deliver his material with vitriol at times, but the impression I was always left with, and the others I've talked to at one of his presentations, was that he's the speaker you come to see, because (from what I see now) his assertions stimulate passions that make you want to take action! It's empowering. That's everything the credenciveness behavior-organ is meant to stimulate: you into power.
Considering the man's proclaimed affiliation, be wary of where the power in this scenario is actually going.
The way I see it, if Antiquatis is supposed to materialize into a school of Reciprocal systems and magick study, there better be real magick going on in that school or its a fraud.
Here again we have to come to an agreement on terms. What you consider real magic may not be what I consider real magic and this is one of those things that would need to be agreed upon when putting a limitation on the system as fraudulent for not falling into a certain mode of perception by others.
Dark occultists organize to get others to do their work for them so they can rule the world.
That generalization doesn't apply across the board.

I agree with what you're getting at here. There is the need to engage the yin aspects of ourselves, the dark side, and empower ourselves. Much of what I've studied in the past few months has been geared towards exactly this. And wouldn't you know it, I'm in the process of moving myself to a new position at work and financially because of the tenets held very dear by dark cabals. There's much misunderstanding about what dark occultism is actually doing.
If Danny is concerned we're not going to carry on with his work, I understand. It's a difficult task being on the outskirts of a society we don't even want to be a part of anymore, as a species are physically separate from, and yet have to interact with for survival and helping others that are evolving the same.
Not wanting to be part of the society with which we are co-evolving is a slippery slope to a poor relationship to yourself as an individual born into / coming from within the collective. There are things within our society that are less than effective and that could be optimized. Be dissatisfied with that - not the society itself. And we don't have to do anything. If we do so it's because we choose to.
We that have been studying have been growing ethically, naturally, and handing out wizarding 101 pamphlets 1.) isn't going to hurt us, and 2.) is sort of like a code in itself, so that if a muggle ever got a hold of it, it's not like he'd be able to all of a sudden conjure all the bananas and flamethrowers he'd want now without deep understanding of self anyway.
The concepts of Wizard/Wizarding have established connotations in people's minds. Do you expect to be taken seriously when handing out pamphlets that share the same name as an MMORPG? And no, people wouldn't be able to conjure up anything tangible, but they would be given the tools to engage in unseen forces the likes of which they have no frame of reference and when you start down this road without enough background development, bad things can and most often will happen as a harmonizing mechanism. Playing (this being the operative word) with magic is something that I personally want no part in promoting.
What's proof is that danny's knowledge in the area would go to waste should he ascend and we'd have to carve our own paths. Though I am definitely on the path of success, it would take longer without the headmaster's faith and assistance.
It would most certainly NOT go to waste. Whatever makes out into the world is enough and what doesn't will go with him. The only thing that would make it take longer without anyone's assistance is one's own resistance to live every day exerting one's will towards the goal. Fanaticism can take you quite far, quite fast... That is if you're willing to consistently engage the system and learn to understand how/why it works the way it does. The only things holding any of us back are ourselves through conscious or unconscious action. When unconscious actions manifest and we feel that things are "in our way" then we should be cognizant of the fact that this is a result of something we've got going on within ourselves and address that. External circumstances are generally reflections of the interiour structure.
"Living is not necessary, but navigation is." --Pompey
"Navigation is necessary in order to live." --Me

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Re: Are People Still Capable of Independent Thought?

Post by Andrew » Wed Dec 06, 2017 10:35 pm

joeyv23 wrote:The question wasn't about what the site was doing wrong but what Bruce was doing wrong. That said, I don't think the site is lacking as is.
The site is an extension of Bruce. He was taking accountability for the lack of a response to his poll when "1600 unique" clients have been visiting each month.
I can understand frustration that people aren't actively engaging as they once did, but we're not them/then. That may sound cold, but that's the reality of the situation.
The reality of the situation is that people 10-20-30 years ago were doing more work than we are now. What is really the difference in us when over time evolution is suppose to occur? That's why I thought the increase in electro-magnetic radiation, along with the crippling nature of fear-based mind control, easy opinions you can post to all your friends that you don't hang out with anymore that you can unfriend at anytime you feel unsafe, contributes to the problem; it's perceptive and directive.
Mark Passio, a lecturer I've mentioned a few times on here, has great, cold and rational, well thought-out presentations on natural law and various other occult topics. But besides just providing his logically deduced knowledge base, he transfers a chord of seriousness, of imminent and persistent threat that is happening right now, and his content one-by-one shows you where he's coming from.
Therein you can see where he is still hooked into the system.
We're talking right now in the system. Our food and jobs is the system. Becoming identified with a Tier 2 value system doesn't make Tier 1 value memes indisposable. If anything, MP is in the yellow vmeme. Just because he's serious doesn't mean he's trapped in a sort of mind control program. Just look at Bruce right here in this thread. "You guys may not be able to carry on everything I've done here. It's gonna go all to the fish. (All for nothing. :cry: )"
Considering the man's proclaimed affiliation, be wary of where the power in this scenario is actually going.
The man is a true anarchist. He affiliates with knowledge and freedom. If you're talking about his past affiliation with satanism: better out than in. And use discernment. Is one really playing a mental job on you if he's giving you the keys to your own jail cell? Or did he develop through hardship and honesty his own independent mind aligned with promoting the expansion of consciousness?
Here again we have to come to an agreement on terms. What you consider real magic may not be what I consider real magic and this is one of those things that would need to be agreed upon when putting a limitation on the system as fraudulent for not falling into a certain mode of perception by others.
There's a lot of New Age groups out there mate that are "magic" groups that are really just old-age religions in the present. Old pagan, wiccan traditions in new clothing/new people. Promising you this and that. Antiquatis, on the other hand, has the TOE to back it up.
Not wanting to be part of the society with which we are co-evolving is a slippery slope to a poor relationship to yourself as an individual born into / coming from within the collective. There are things within our society that are less than effective and that could be optimized. Be dissatisfied with that - not the society itself. And we don't have to do anything. If we do so it's because we choose to.
What's really up in the air are the following concepts and how/if they are interrelated:

1.) Striving for unity
-But carbon expels silicon (&vice versa)
2.) Scalar motion, discrete units, and hierarchy
-There will always be those who want to bring you down to their level and have everything you have without doing any of the work.
-This function is inconsistent with nature. You may intermingle with a different "class" such as muggles, but you are not one of them anymore. Once you start on the path, you can only move forward.
Dark occultists organize to get others to do their work for them so they can rule the world.
That generalization doesn't apply across the board.
-The dark "path" tends to entice you and eventually blackmails you so that you can't get out without severe retribution. This is not about the unconscious/shadow self, but organizations that choose ignorance.
The concepts of Wizard/Wizarding have established connotations in people's minds. Do you expect to be taken serious when handing out pamphlets that share the same name as an MMORPG? And no, people wouldn't be able to conjure up anything tangible, but they would engage in unseen forces the likes of which they have no frame of reference and when you start down this road bad things can and most often will happen as a harmonizing mechanism. Playing (this being the operative word) with magic is something that I personally want no part in promoting.
Lol. I didn't mean to conjure thoughts of handing out actual pamphlets. I meant to describe the limit of the papers' reach. Seriously, the only reason I came across daniel was because of Wilcox, and I don't even read Wilcox. Even though daniel is smart and charming in his absolute one-sidedness, as Fred Flinstone, in investigating all that has been wrong in astronomy, social activity, history, mythology, etc. etc. he himself uses exactly what MMORPGs do: avatars. A yin-based ego. You can make it whatever you want. Sort of like a super-hero or our better half imagined.
It would most certainly NOT go to waste. Whatever makes out into the world is enough and what doesn't will go with him. The only thing that would make it take longer without anyone's assistance is one's own resistance to live every day exerting one's will towards the goal.
Exerting one's will takes time. Which is why Bruce is frustrated. I don't see the "deer's trail" here in the RS unless I read Dewey and everyone that followed up on him, like Bruce, like Nehru. Like everyone here in Antiquatis and CH that gives a damn. And that's a lot of reading. I'm at the point in my life I'm really pissed off at having to read and learn for all of my damn life. All that school I've been forced to go through that I actually liked, and then having to pay to go to a school that force-fed me shit I'd later have to vomit out.

Words only go so far. Every other job out there has a power that goes along with that knowledge. Here, where's the power? Have you manifested your dreams yet? Where's the legitimacy? Makes sense theoretically, RS.

I'm just all about going all-in. What this theory means, is that my dreams can become reality. Not just the age-old tales of riches and beautiful women, a.k.a. "the bananas," but the power of our dreams manifest in real instantaneous clock time by our will, and through our knowledge and being. Whatever that constitutes.

If all his knowledge dies, it does go to waste. And here we are, looking around, like we can't get no love. No recognition. 1600 people. 13 hang around. Big whoop. Nature has demonstrated we'll go extinct at this rate without some damn confidence we know something that's worth knowing about.
joeyv23 wrote:External circumstances are generally reflections of the interiour structure.
Andrew wrote:The real metaphysical is really the effect of my ethical control units in myself and circumstances upon time and space = consciousness/free-will.
You're missing something here. Don't limit this to only your ethical control units which lend logically towards free-will. There is also the exertion of control units outside of ourselves that influences us in a way that we can only really consider compulsory. Free-will alone doesn't constitute the totality of the active principle of our reality on/within us.
Yes, generally our modern, peaceful lives reflect our interior structure. But if you don't know there's a war against what makes our evolution possible, I understand. It's hard to communicate that level of attack. I think you can understand, Joey, that the only reason a war can exist is that the universe doesn't conform to our individual outlooks. There is a "legacy" that people like to know they have left behind before they die. It means their lives meant something towards some kind of purpose. Something Larson did believe in.

Sure, nature will take its time. But humanity has very little time. I believe in Renaissance, but I also see the war that humanity is leaving (the NWO) the war it is entering (techno mind control) and being on the other side of both of those control devices.

Humans are a quasi-unity of carbon and silicon, but the body pushes out the silicon as a shield for sensitive areas (toenails and fingernails.) Those two elements certainly aren't of equal resourcefulness in the body.

What kind of analogy can be made for wizards and techno-muggles unifying?
"Classical historians traditionally dismiss tales of magic as unworthy of scholarly attention, but to us any mention of a witch's broomstick or wizard's wand evokes the smell of a scientist's laboratory." The Sphinx and the Megaliths

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Re: Are People Still Capable of Independent Thought?

Post by DSKlausler » Thu Dec 07, 2017 1:31 pm

Andrew wrote:
Wed Dec 06, 2017 7:01 pm
What's proof is that danny's knowledge in the area would go to waste should he ascend and we'd have to carve our own paths. Though I am definitely on the path of success, it would take longer without the headmaster's faith and assistance.
I wholeheartedly concur; and I don't need to expand upon it.
Anything is possible with the proper training.

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Re: Are People Still Capable of Independent Thought?

Post by joeyv23 » Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:24 pm

Andrew wrote:
Wed Dec 06, 2017 10:35 pm
joeyv23 wrote:The question wasn't about what the site was doing wrong but what Bruce was doing wrong. That said, I don't think the site is lacking as is.
The site is an extension of Bruce. He was taking accountability for the lack of a response to his poll when "1600 unique" clients have been visiting each month.
Fair enough.
Considering the man's proclaimed affiliation, be wary of where the power in this scenario is actually going.
The man is a true anarchist. He affiliates with knowledge and freedom. If you're talking about his past affiliation with satanism: better out than in. And use discernment. Is one really playing a mental job on you if he's giving you the keys to your own jail cell? Or did he develop through hardship and honesty his own independent mind aligned with promoting the expansion of consciousness?
Just in reading how you described your relation to his work, that he makes you want to be present for his lectures, it's obvious that he's getting a considerable amount of power from those that do attend. This is only natural, I just wanted to point out that there is benefit in considering the flow of energy in those type environments at a wider scale.
But if you don't know there's a war against what makes our evolution possible, I understand. It's hard to communicate that level of attack. I think you can understand, Joey, that the only reason a war can exist is that the universe doesn't conform to our individual outlooks.
Herein I can see the same hooks in you. The way in which you perceive this "war" indicates what I was getting at before, seeing Passio's relative position via you by proxy. (I feel like there should be a Latin phrase for the preceding four words... I digress.) I know what you're talking about and at one time saw it as a war. And on that level, it's existence and legitimacy as such is valid. This is not, however, the only way to view the situation. Not really clear on what you mean about the universe not conforming to our individual outlooks and how that relates to this war that you, Passio, and others perceive.

Not wanting to be part of the society with which we are co-evolving is a slippery slope to a poor relationship to yourself as an individual born into / coming from within the collective. There are things within our society that are less than effective and that could be optimized. Be dissatisfied with that - not the society itself. And we don't have to do anything. If we do so it's because we choose to.
What's really up in the air are the following concepts and how/if they are interrelated:

1.) Striving for unity
-But carbon expels silicon (&vice versa)

2.) Scalar motion, discrete units, and hierarchy
-There will always be those who want to bring you down to their level and have everything you have without doing any of the work.
There are also those that want to help you up, who have no need for taking from you and are busting their asses to make their way in life. The coin has two sides. Don't forget that.
-This function is inconsistent with nature. You may intermingle with a different "class" such as muggles, but you are not one of them anymore. Once you start on the path, you can only move forward.
Billy has a similar view on the nature of nature and how things going on are inconsistent with that, but I have to ask, Are they really?
Dark occultists organize to get others to do their work for them so they can rule the world.
That generalization doesn't apply across the board.
-The dark "path" tends to entice you and eventually blackmails you so that you can't get out without severe retribution. This is not about the unconscious/shadow self, but organizations that choose ignorance.
I'm not really sure that what you're looking at is the same as what I know the "dark side" to be. The path isn't out to seduce or blackmail you. And the dark side as I know is absolutely about the unconscious/shadow side, since there's an immediate and direct correlation between the unconscious and yin/darkness and through RS parlance, cosmic. The dark side, being something that is generally taboo within the collective is repressed (or there is an attempt to do so at least) at the collective level. Interesting noticing the way you've approached the topic of unconscious and thinking about the mention made in the Hogwarts thread about a subconscious influence that wasn't relevant.
Exerting one's will takes time. Which is why Bruce is frustrated. I don't see the "deer's trail" here in the RS unless I read Dewey and everyone that followed up on him, like Bruce, like Nehru. Like everyone here in Antiquatis and CH that gives a damn. And that's a lot of reading. I'm at the point in my life I'm really pissed off at having to read and learn for all of my damn life. All that school I've been forced to go through that I actually liked, and then having to pay to go to a school that force-fed me shit I'd later have to vomit out.
Exertion of will may manifest over time but the exertion of will itself, is instantaneous. Something Yoda said about doing or not doing. You even indicate the same in what you said next...
I'm just all about going all-in. What this theory means, is that my dreams can become reality. Not just the age-old tales of riches and beautiful women, a.k.a. "the bananas," but the power of our dreams manifest in real instantaneous clock time by our will, and through our knowledge and being. Whatever that constitutes.
Look into the concept of phantasia. How much of your dreams is in alignment with what is viable within the current environment? Is it possible that there is room to see things from a different angle, that maybe some of what we dream up, while fun, isn't going to happen the way we think they could/should.
If all his knowledge dies, it does go to waste. And here we are, looking around, like we can't get no love. No recognition. 1600 people. 13 hang around. Big whoop. Nature has demonstrated we'll go extinct at this rate without some damn confidence we know something that's worth knowing about.
All of his knowledge can't possibly die because we have quite a bit of it between ourselves and documented online. Even that which might not make it out into our world doesn't die. The person as a generator/conduit/receptacle for information is not the end-all go to for the information that they generate/conduct/hold. Also, if something doesn't make it out into the world before he goes then it should be evident that there's a reason for that. As for nature's demonstration, consider where 'we' is applicable and where it's beneficial to separate from that. I'm not going extinct. How's that for confidence? ;)
joeyv23 wrote:External circumstances are generally reflections of the interiour structure.
Andrew wrote:The real metaphysical is really the effect of my ethical control units in myself and circumstances upon time and space = consciousness/free-will.
You're missing something here. Don't limit this to only your ethical control units which lend logically towards free-will. There is also the exertion of control units outside of ourselves that influences us in a way that we can only really consider compulsory. Free-will alone doesn't constitute the totality of the active principle of our reality on/within us.
Yes, generally our modern, peaceful lives reflect our interior structure.
I refer back to my previous comment about remembering the other side of the coin.
Sure, nature will take its time. But humanity has very little time.
This is part of the programming. If you ask Gopi, he'll give you several examples of how time has been lost or taken out of our conscious experience and feeling like we couldn't possibly have a long future ahead of us is a product of this development in our lives. Perhaps we don't have much clock time. So what? How do you operate in your everyday life with this at the front of your attention? Reaction to the programming that we are out of time engenders that we actually do run out of time faster than we might otherwise have done.
What kind of analogy can be made for wizards and techno-muggles unifying?
That's the question, isn't it?
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Re: Independent Thought Discussion

Post by Andrew » Fri Dec 08, 2017 8:10 pm

Just in reading how you described your relation to his work, that he makes you want to be present for his lectures, it's obvious that he's getting a considerable amount of power from those that do attend. This is only natural, I just wanted to point out that there is benefit in considering the flow of energy in those type environments at a wider scale.
There certainly was a benefit being in that environment. I made new friends and was able to speak without fear of sounding like a paranoid weirdo. Very cathartic, knowing you're not the only one that can see what the majority chooses to ignore and discredit.
Herein I can see the same hooks in you. The way in which you perceive this "war" indicates what I was getting at before, seeing Passio's relative position via you by proxy. (I feel like there should be a Latin phrase for the preceding four words... I digress.) I know what you're talking about and at one time saw it as a war. And on that level, it's existence and legitimacy as such is valid. This is not, however, the only way to view the situation. Not really clear on what you mean about the universe not conforming to our individual outlooks and how that relates to this war that you, Passio, and others perceive.
Passio describes the ailment as a choice in a dialectic of trauma. One at an early age unconsciously chooses to identify with either the aggressor of a violation or the victim of the violation. The aggressor roots his choices from the values of the left brain hemisphere. The victim resorts to the values of the right brain hemisphere. (In America, this forms the basis of our Right vs. Left party politics [which is a joke, as LB accurately stated and Mark thoroughly explains.]) There can be no true Unity through force, because the state of force to maintain the illusion of unity is slavery.

In a post from not long ago, LB was saying (I'm paraphrasing) look at where you were and what you were supposed to do, and then examine why you didn't and that will reveal a lot about your choices and your psychology.

Think back to when you decided you didn't want to be a ... swimmer, was it? It's easy to say ask yourself why, but the harder question to ask yourself honestly was did people really expect this was the extent of my expression in life? Was this a control mechanism planted for me to grasp onto by people before I was born? If I was a swimmer, would I still be in the matrix? Is that the ideal situation these owners of the State want? And what of magick? Does that fit into the State?

Image
George wrote:It's a big club, and you ain't in it.
Your thinking only goes so far. People well before you were born in this life, and before your past life let's say, have been working on keeping you predictable and sedentary. In a cage.

You were declared war on before you even knew it. Mark, Bruce, and I work to not only show that, but to provide solutions that doesn't involve taking them down through force. A wheel goes through a revolution, round and round, over and over again. We don't need to do all of this over again. We've done it enough. We need to get off the wheel and into the car.
There are also those that want to help you up, who have no need for taking from you and are busting their asses to make their way in life. The coin has two sides. Don't forget that.
An ideal thought, but the reality is that life is an exchange of energy ... if you can't grow it somehow, a la the Philosopher's Stone. Your thought reminds me of well-to-do Christians that work to feed the poor and do good in the name of Christ. And many certainly do charitable work on the individual and small group level. The bigger the charity gets though, the more their motivations meet economics.

What I mean is that people can be charitable, but that service-to-others comes at an expense to the giver's energy, which I've seen firsthand in many cases causes the said giver to retaliate against their peers in frustration, exhaustion, anxiety, and an overall feeling of "when will it be over?" and "haven't I done enough?"

That's the other side of the coin. What is the coin? Power.
Billy has a similar view on the nature of nature and how things going on are inconsistent with that, but I have to ask, Are they really?
Why not?
I'm not really sure that what you're looking at is the same as what I know the "dark side" to be. The path isn't out to seduce or blackmail you. And the dark side as I know is absolutely about the unconscious/shadow side, since there's an immediate and direct correlation between the unconscious and yin/darkness and through RS parlance, cosmic.
The "dark side" as an organization, known as the Cabal or NWO, chooses ignorance, and advertises and promotes ignorance. I mean, just look at the Republican party here. Their modus operandi is get government out of your lives and we'll be a better country. But they are the government! They happen to really love the police and military too! If freedom-loving people really went all the way, they would be anarchists (definition=without masters) and defend themselves with guns, wands, whatever, at all times. (Like in an MMORPG :wink: )

In this sense, dark side is congruent with daniel's definition of evil: the suppression of consciousness. Hence, their claim to authority, their government, is a joke. (I'm doing this for your good! *bang bang* *war war* *depression depression* *election election* *law of sympathy* *play stupid games, win stupid prizes*)

The cabal is the macrocosmic effect of choosing ignorance. The person dealing with their shadow side is in the microcosmic. The cabal encourages ignorance through government and religion, and so the repression occurs in the masses that accept that decision (hive-mind thinking/ not independent.)
Interesting noticing the way you've approached the topic of unconscious and thinking about the mention made in the Hogwarts thread about a subconscious influence that wasn't relevant.
I didn't think the flower was as relevant at the time as the dream language. However, combining its symbolism with the characters and dialogue that contain reference to other flowers and the language of flowers that used to exist in great variety back when mail took longer than a second to deliver, I see greater meaning in it now.
"Classical historians traditionally dismiss tales of magic as unworthy of scholarly attention, but to us any mention of a witch's broomstick or wizard's wand evokes the smell of a scientist's laboratory." The Sphinx and the Megaliths

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LoneBear
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Re: Independent Thought Discussion

Post by LoneBear » Fri Dec 08, 2017 8:48 pm

Andrew wrote:
Fri Dec 08, 2017 8:10 pm
The "dark side" as an organization, known as the Cabal or NWO, chooses ignorance, and advertises and promotes ignorance. ...

In this sense, dark side is congruent with daniel's definition of evil: the suppression of consciousness. Hence, their claim to authority, their government, is a joke. (I'm doing this for your good! *bang bang* *war war* *depression depression* *election election* *law of sympathy* *play stupid games, win stupid prizes*)
The Cabal, et al, is the "Dark side of the Farce," not the Force. It is designed to keep you ignorant and entertained with trivial pursuits that have no meaning beyond the emotional charge they provide for the few moments they have your attention. However, one must consider that this "charge" of persona is ALL that people have these days, since they lack spirit and the corresponding ethical control units.

Passio is definitely loaded with testosterone (though technically, DHT with all that hair), a feature that is sorely missed by men in an estrogen-dominated society. That is what Satanism, in general, cashes in on--literally. Men want their testosterone back, and if they can't get it, they engage in transference to someone that gets that "fight/flee" mechanism going. Passio's lectures are charged with testosterone and epinephrine.

It comes down to this... the Dark Side of the Farce cannot suppress what does not exist, namely consciousness in the "mindless masses." As I've repeated ad nauseum in my discussions, "you can either think it, or feel it." A lack of consciousness only allows the latter, so the Dark Side provides the mechanisms to create feelings, and controls the response reaction.

That is ALL they do. There is no battle for freedom; they won the war, centuries ago. Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose. As long as you keep "spinning your wheels," you'll never engage any real system of power or magick--because you cannot "get a grip" on anything to give you the force necessary to create power... power = force x distance. When force=0, no matter how far you appear to travel, you still have no power.

Which brings us to the Dark Arts, not the "dark side ." The Dark Arts are where the true power is, but cannot be approach as long as one is afraid of change.

Fear, Power, Knowledge, Clarity, Old Age.

Your 5 best friends and worst enemies, as each has components of the dark and the light. The trick is to become the grey wizard--not a shade or blending, but a harmony, where you command both sides.

As the greeting of the Minbari Grey Council states, "I am Grey. I stand between the candle and the star.
We are Grey. We stand between the darkness and the light."

Note very carefully that I/we "stand BETWEEN" as a separate entity. Neither and both dark and light. This is harmonia.
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Re: Independent Thought Discussion

Post by joeyv23 » Fri Dec 08, 2017 9:50 pm

Andrew wrote:
Fri Dec 08, 2017 8:10 pm
Think back to when you decided you didn't want to be a ... swimmer, was it?
Spaceman's the swimmer. I was in the Navy and received an early-out.
It's easy to say ask yourself why, but the harder question to ask yourself honestly was did people really expect this was the extent of my expression in life?
I'm not sure how I could honestly ask myself what the expectations of others might or might not be. I knew that my experience with the military was only one of many to be added to my toolkit that I might one day accomplish my goals in life.
Your thinking only goes so far.

Mirror, mirror. Read that back to yourself as if it were being directed at you. Therein you may find some Gold.
People well before you were born in this life, and before your past life let's say, have been working on keeping you predictable and sedentary. In a cage.
Still identifying with the victim of the violation then? :wink:
You were declared war on before you even knew it.
How do you know that I didn't know?
Mark, Bruce, and I work to not only show that, but to provide solutions that doesn't involve taking them down through force.
Clique formation Alpha, unite! :D
There are also those that want to help you up, who have no need for taking from you and are busting their asses to make their way in life. The coin has two sides. Don't forget that.
An ideal thought, but the reality is that life is an exchange of energy ... if you can't grow it somehow, a la the Philosopher's Stone. Your thought reminds me of well-to-do Christians that work to feed the poor and do good in the name of Christ. And many certainly do charitable work on the individual and small group level. The bigger the charity gets though, the more their motivations meet economics.
You missed what I was trying to get at here for the sake of some dissatisfaction with Blue.
Billy has a similar view on the nature of nature and how things going on are inconsistent with that, but I have to ask, Are they really?
Why not?
Your question in response to my question comes across as incoherent here. You'll have to clarify.
LoneBear wrote:
Fri Dec 08, 2017 8:48 pm
A lack of consciousness only allows the latter, so the Dark Side provides the mechanisms to create feelings, and controls the response reaction.
Don't you mean emotions, per this conversation? Or have I misinterpreted something?
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"Navigation is necessary in order to live." --Me

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Re: Are People Still Capable of Independent Thought?

Post by Ilkka » Sat Dec 09, 2017 6:09 am

Andrew wrote:
Wed Dec 06, 2017 10:35 pm
I'm at the point in my life I'm really pissed off at having to read and learn for all of my damn life
I have learned that emotions do affect the way we think and what we say so this might be the reason why you feel/"emote" this way now and in not too distant future. Maybe you would feel better some time after that point of "not too distant future".

Angry emotions usually cloud our judgement and I remember in this action movie "Shoot em Up" was a mention about how getting angry lowers ones IQ remarkably. I have seen it in action myself included.

The wolf of light and dark inside us (I read about it from that Power up your brain book). How about not feeding them at all, or feeding them both adequately so that they both may live in good health inside us, I mean that if you only feed the other and gets bloated/fat now that is unhealthy. Isnt that the "Harmonia" that LB mentioned?

It just seems from the way I read Andrew's recent posts that there is alot of that one side thinking going on, gotta find something to balance it, back to the grey area. I know this from experince.
Enjoy the Silence

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