The role of the monetary system in the building of Kheb

Kheb is a monastery, remote but not secluded, where people can have an alternative to the mercantile system that is imposed upon society by our political and educational institutions. It is a physical PLACE, and this topic is to discuss the facilities, structures, accommodations, and other physical constructs needed to successfully implement the ideas behind the Sanctuary Project, as well as the "political" structures of a new type of monastic system.
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The role of the monetary system in the building of Kheb

Post by Billy » Wed Sep 03, 2014 9:11 am

I am curious to know how it works in terms of establishing the land for the Kheb Monastery, and what exactly the strategy happens to be for purchasing and maintaining that land working within the parameters of the current system.

The very idea that anyone should have to pay to live upon the land, or that one 'owns' that land, is quite absurd. It seems like such a simple idea, but most people simply cannot see it; or else, they are so accepting of the current state of the monetary system that they cannot think differently. Plus, people just love saying that, "this is MINE, I OWN it." As if the Earth really cares :-)

Ultimately, we want to get away from this absurd system of monetary exchange that has been built up all around us, but its influence is so pervasive that it leads me to wonder: Apart from local alternative systems of currency, which perhaps act as a sort of temporary segue to something else, (that will ultimately lead us away from the concept of money all together), what other options exist for building such a community in our lifetimes without vast sums of money to purchase the land, pay persistent land tax fees, and any of the other forms of 'payment' that the tax man can dream up? Also, what about regulation of the land itself? One cannot even place a bird feeder in one's yard, it seems, without first getting it approved of by some local governmental body. I've been seeing some of these issues arise in my own neighborhood in regards to gardens and sculptures. Bureaucrats jump at the chance to point a finger and say, "You can't have that there, it's not regulation."

So how is it that Antiquatis plans to handle all of this? What ideas or plans have been drawn up? I know that Panama has been talked about at length as a possible future site; and I of course know nothing about how such things work in Panama. Perhaps the regulations and the fees are more loosey-goosey? Still, in order to sustain the local economy in such an intentional community, (at least for the foreseeable future), some form of money will be needed; again, unless a better and more common-sense system can be devised, one that the system itself cannot pounce upon and shut down because it doesn't abide by the law of the current framework.

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Billy

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Re: The role of the monetary system in the building of Kheb

Post by LoneBear » Wed Sep 03, 2014 12:01 pm

Billy wrote:I am curious to know how it works in terms of establishing the land for the Kheb Monastery, and what exactly the strategy happens to be for purchasing and maintaining that land working within the parameters of the current system.
First, determine what money is used for, which in order of priority is:
  1. Paying tribute to the gods that claim ownership of you (taxation, tithing). This is nothing but hypocrisy under the name of "helping to better your life" by those that use your resources to make a life of luxury for themselves.
  2. Barter to obtain goods and services necessary for survival. This comes from the fact that not all people and locations can produce the necessary requirements for survival (can't build a house without wood, etc), so by maintaining a surplus of what you do have or produce, you can exchange it for those things you don't have or cannot produce.
  3. Barter to obtain luxuries. Once survival needs are met, trade can be used for luxuries that improve the quality of life.
If you want a good, fast and humorous lesson on how money was created, used and abused by the banksters, I recommend reading Irwin Schiff's The Kingdom of Moltz. (It's a comic book, and fast read.)

Outside of building an island in international waters and making our own "country," we will be stuck with the current, corrupt system of taxation and tithing. Appropriate choice of location can minimize that, as there are many places that respect religious institutions, such as a monastery, and exempt them from taxation. A tax-exempt location would be preferable.

As for the concept of land ownership (which really puzzled the Native Americans with the Europeans), we are stuck with it--but there are workarounds known as "Trusts" which can be used to create an artificial entity to represent the Earth, that can "own" the property instead of human ownership. (Yes, everything is backwards...)
Billy wrote:Ultimately, we want to get away from this absurd system of monetary exchange that has been built up all around us, but its influence is so pervasive that it leads me to wonder: Apart from local alternative systems of currency, which perhaps act as a sort of temporary segue to something else, (that will ultimately lead us away from the concept of money all together), what other options exist for building such a community in our lifetimes without vast sums of money to purchase the land, pay persistent land tax fees, and any of the other forms of 'payment' that the tax man can dream up?
In the past, groups have set out to unexplored lands to start a new life, like the Mormons did here in Utah. But countries have "laid claim" to every square inch of dirt on the planet, right down to the snowflakes in Antarctica. The only unclaimed location are the "international waters," but they keep extending the economic zones of countries out to even claim them. So outside of the concepts put forth in Marshall Savages' book, The Millennium Project with Aquarius, or spelunking down to Agartha in the inner Earth, or getting the L-Ms to donate an Ark or transportation to another world, I don't see many alternatives here, but I am open to suggestions.

(I do agree with Alex Jones with his view of "civilized society" as a Prison Planet--and we are the prisoners of the children of the Gods.)
Billy wrote:Also, what about regulation of the land itself? One cannot even place a bird feeder in one's yard, it seems, without first getting it approved of by some local governmental body. I've been seeing some of these issues arise in my own neighborhood in regards to gardens and sculptures. Bureaucrats jump at the chance to point a finger and say, "You can't have that there, it's not regulation."
Again, religion to the rescue... there are exceptions for religious groups, such as the Amish. But the best solution is to be in an area that does not have all these ludicrous covenants and regulations, which are done to improve resale value, and the bankers get more money from the sale.
Billy wrote:So how is it that Antiquatis plans to handle all of this? What ideas or plans have been drawn up? I know that Panama has been talked about at length as a possible future site; and I of course know nothing about how such things work in Panama. Perhaps the regulations and the fees are more loosey-goosey? Still, in order to sustain the local economy in such an intentional community, (at least for the foreseeable future), some form of money will be needed; again, unless a better and more common-sense system can be devised, one that the system itself cannot pounce upon and shut down because it doesn't abide by the law of the current framework.
My comments are written up here and on the main site (Monastery tab). In my opinion, "poor" countries that have abundant resources (like Central America) are good choices because you have a minimum of government involvement with the peasant folks (of which we would be considered), and they tend to respect religious institutions, of which a Monastery qualifies. If you review my Institute plans, the idea was to have a front-end non-profit corporation that could provide the funds necessary to the Monastic trust to maintain its operation without having to be of concern to those doing the monastic work. The self-sufficiency goal of the monastery removes much of the need for money, and it may be that more enlightened people could get positions in local government to change things for the better, by removing ridiculous regulations.

(Rainer Huck, President of ISUS that promotes the Reciprocal System, is running for the Utah House of Representatives just for this reason--he's fed up with the nit-picky regulations, which won't even allow him to put a safety fence on his deck! See: http://huck4house.com)
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Re: The role of the monetary system in the building of Kheb

Post by Lozion » Wed Sep 03, 2014 12:46 pm

Money is also a middleman for energy. If we can develop alternative energy systems, then the Kheb community could be self-sufficient reducing the need for outside interaction and use of currency. Not to stir the thread in another direction, I'm curious to hear your comments on this project for the development of a free quantum energy device:

http://hopegirl2012.wordpress.com/2014/ ... ormations/

Seems a whole crew of people elected to live in northern Morocco to develop a alternative community based on the use of such devices.
I have no idea if this solution is real or snake oil but should it be functional, the Kheb monastery may want to look into aquiring one.
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Re: The role of the monetary system in the building of Kheb

Post by Ilkka » Wed Sep 03, 2014 3:08 pm

I can see some down sides when the "poor" country is in question. Criminals and especially some paid criminals they are the worst. If the governments or companies doesnt like Monastery people they might send some "terrorists" to terrorize and trash the place up among stealing stuff etc. So Monastery would need some protectors also, maybe not in the firsthand but eventually atleast. Maybe these protectors could be the "magicians" perhaps we might have Mo-Pai Nei Kung guys on our side in the monastery, they might be akin to the whole monastery idea even, because of the "seclusion" and stuff. BTW Today I finished reading "Nei Kung: The Secret Teachings of the Warrior Sages" book fascinating stuff, got to training few days ago. The book was inspirational because I have Qigong videos by Ken Cohen which has similarities also and useful. The thing is that I cant play by the rules, I just have to go look for "short cuts" which might be or might not be a good thing.
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Re: The role of the monetary system in the building of Kheb

Post by Obzistian » Thu Feb 09, 2017 12:45 pm

My wife and I were discussing this very subject last night. Here, in the USA, the only places with 'exceptions'
to the rules are Amish country and native american reservations.
A monastery just might be the right type of organization to be accepted by the tribes
on a reservation. Especially one that does not actively seek to convert the local population or
change its belief system.
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Re: The role of the monetary system in the building of Kheb

Post by Ilkka » Thu Feb 09, 2017 2:38 pm

Obzistian wrote:
Thu Feb 09, 2017 12:45 pm
Here, in the USA, the only places with 'exceptions' to the rules are Amish country and native american reservations.
This is quite good idea, it might work. I however have no knowledge about laws and such since I live in opposite side of northern hemisphere. The ideal place would have good climate for growing fruits and veggies all year long but it would need to be in southern parts of the U.S.
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Re: The role of the monetary system in the building of Kheb

Post by joeyv23 » Thu Feb 09, 2017 8:29 pm

Obzistian wrote: A monastery just might be the right type of organization to be accepted by the tribes on a reservation. Especially one that does not actively seek to convert the local population or change its belief system.
Speaking from the experience that I've had and what I've witnessed since moving West and encountering several tribal groups, I can't say that this would be the case with the Natives. What I have seen is a loss of identity and detachment from spiritual matters. There are still a few who are what I would consider a true native, or more aptly, true to their native spirit, but by and large spiritual inclination has been replaced by material focus. Most natives that I've encountered are no different than any other American. They are unhealthy, drugged up, and materially driven. I doubt that they would be welcoming of anyone trying to move in, regardless of the motives, because they are essentially stuck right now with the issues of their loss of health and identity and the struggle to survive as a result. Even those who may still be somewhat spiritually inclined seem more likely to smile and nod than to really engage in an effort to create a viable solution. From what I can see--save the few exceptions to the rule--the spiritual nature of the native people of America is dead.
Ilkka wrote:The ideal place would have good climate for growing fruits and veggies all year long but it would need to be in southern parts of the U.S.
While year-round growing would be ideal, I think it may be a limiting factor that will need to be worked around, at least at first. There is furtile land in the southern part of the state here in Utah that is being heavily considered for a variety of reasons that I'll leave for LB to detail since he has the most up-to-date rundown on that front.
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Re: The role of the monetary system in the building of Kheb

Post by LoneBear » Sat Feb 11, 2017 1:16 pm

Spaceman and I visited the Navajo reservation a couple months ago, and the first thing we saw was "oil donkeys" as far as the eye could see. Since the BIA (Bureau of Indian Affairs) constantly screws them over, they basically sold out to the oil companies out of survival necessity. The tribes that do not have desirable resources are basically poverty-stricken and are still operating in the purple/red vMemes. On the east coast, the tribes were successful by converting to materialism--casinos. They remind me of the Centauri Republic on Babylon 5... to paraphrase Londo, "Welcome to the Mohegan Casino, open 9 to 5, white man time."

Nice idea, but I cannot see how it could work in this country (or any "civilized" region).
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Re: The role of the monetary system in the building of Kheb

Post by Ilkka » Sat Feb 11, 2017 2:11 pm

joeyv23 wrote:
Thu Feb 09, 2017 8:29 pm
There is furtile land in the southern part of the state here in Utah that is being heavily considered for a variety of reasons that I'll leave for LB to detail since he has the most up-to-date rundown on that front.
How long is the summer season in there approximately and how cold it gets in winter at most?

Its too bad that there is most likely no room for such a place in Native territories.
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Re: The role of the monetary system in the building of Kheb

Post by LoneBear » Sat Feb 11, 2017 5:30 pm

Ilkka wrote:
Sat Feb 11, 2017 2:11 pm
How long is the summer season in there approximately and how cold it gets in winter at most?
It changes considerably, as the seasons seem to be coming earlier (winter is starting in October, not December). Couple days ago, it was sunny and 68F. Last year, it was still snowing when the trees were budding. Thank the geoengineers, I guess!
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Re: The role of the monetary system in the building of Kheb

Post by joeyv23 » Sat Feb 11, 2017 7:36 pm

LoneBear wrote:
Sat Feb 11, 2017 5:30 pm
Ilkka wrote:
Sat Feb 11, 2017 2:11 pm
How long is the summer season in there approximately and how cold it gets in winter at most?
It changes considerably, as the seasons seem to be coming earlier (winter is starting in October, not December). Couple days ago, it was sunny and 68F. Last year, it was still snowing when the trees were budding. Thank the geoengineers, I guess!
There's also the situation of the unique geology of the areas around here creating microclimates. Down near the Capital Reef park, you can travel 30 minutes through a corner of the park and have a whole months or more difference for a growing season. When we gathered here a year ago we experienced a mild to warm weekend. The geoengineering is definitely something that may leave us having to make the best with what we have.
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Re: The role of the monetary system in the building of Kheb

Post by Ilkka » Sun Feb 12, 2017 6:09 am

LoneBear wrote:
Sat Feb 11, 2017 5:30 pm
It changes considerably, as the seasons seem to be coming earlier (winter is starting in October, not December). Couple days ago, it was sunny and 68F. Last year, it was still snowing when the trees were budding. Thank the geoengineers, I guess!
In Finland its been about the opposite, winter starts later than sooner which it used to start years ago. Last year in December there was only rain and warm air and around Christmas started to be like winter. Some years back summer started early at the start of April but it usually starts around early May. Last year might have been an exeption because snowfall usually starts in late October or early November. Or should we say "supposed to start", if it weren't the geoengineers doing their thing.
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